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Wife's (and mine) best friend

William

William

Member
Male
So I have been talking about going poly with my wife (we can call her G) for years. She was completely against it, much due to my way of bringing it up with her being too pushy to say the least. Now though, we are at a point she is open to me dating/courting another woman with the intention to build a relationship that would potentially become marriage. I had come to believe before this that polygamy was ok, but not in the works for my future.
So this year our best friend (call her S) came into our lives. She is finishing college and then a phd before considering dating, so she hasn't dated anyone before. So there are several years to come before starting a courtship would be an option, if at all. The only restriction my wife has about dating women is that I am not to date our best friend S. Her reasoning is she doesn't make friends very easily, and would hate for things to not work out and their friendship fall apart. It is honestly a fear that I share as its a friendship I do not want to loose, however I believe its a risk that can be mitigated.
My problem right now is, perhaps its closed minded, I don't see anyone else as a possibility. S spent the summer living at our house. It was a really great dynamic, and she has what I am looking for in a potential wife. We didn't live in the mindset of future marriage, but it was an idea that grew in my head over the last few weeks before she left. I explained to my wife first and later to S that I had developed romantic feelings for S and was open to dating if they were. With that in mind, my wife wants to help me find someone else, because she knows I want to explore more practically if poly is right for our family, and she wants to help me get past my feelings for S. Its putting me in a strange place, because at this point I feel as though the right woman has been put there, I am just being told to have patience and wait for her to come to terms with polygamy as she completes her degree.
The idea of looking for anyone else seems like I am substituting, not even compromising but that I would go on a date and just compare why S is superior to whomever I am considering as a potential second wife. That attempting to date someone else would just be a placeholder, practice for when S is in a position professionally to be in a relationship and mentally to accept poly, if that day ever comes.
Has anyone here seen some of these components before? Objections I have to work through with my wife about risking her best friend for the potential gain of having s join our family as a wife, as well as objection of a young woman to the polygamy lifestyle, not necessarily in general, but in her own future. Not that I want to force her, but I wish there was a way to discuss it over the coming years to sway her. Additionally, I wouldn't have a serious conversation about it with S until I get through my wife's objection first. Some may say its not her place, but there is a component of being on the same page that mkes a marriage work alot smoother.
I have lots of time, and understand through the mistakes of others here, and even my own early mistakes that forcing the issue and being impatient will only blow up in my face. I just need encouragement and direction.
Thanks in advance
 
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Mojo said:
Shalom and welcome.

What's your spiritual life like? Are all of you believers?
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Yes, we all believe in God, I am still getting an understanding of the beliefs of S, she definitely believes in God, though never went to church until living with us this summer.

I have always been non-denomination Christian growing up, bouncing between Baptist to nazarine to home gatherings and periods of not going to church due to various circumstances.

My wife, G, grew up Mormon but abandoned those beliefs on her own and later with some re-enforcement from myself, and now considers herself non-denominational Christian as well.

We had a very tough 2017 with a death of my brother at 33 and other hard times in my own house which I'd prefer to not discuss, but it left my wife distant from God and only recently have I been able to get her coming closer to him.
 
William said:
Yes, we all believe in God, I am still getting an understanding of the beliefs of S, she definitely believes in God, though never went to church until living with us this summer.

I have always been non-denomination Christian growing up, bouncing between Baptist to nazarine to home gatherings and periods of not going to church due to various circumstances.

My wife, G, grew up Mormon but abandoned those beliefs on her own and later with some re-enforcement from myself, and now considers herself non-denominational Christian as well.

We had a very tough 2017 with a death of my brother at 33 and other hard times in my own house which I'd prefer to not discuss, but it left my wife distant from God and only recently have I been able to get her coming closer to him.
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Welcome! I pray that all of you will grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
 
Shalom and welcome, @William. Sounds like you are in a good position. Patience! Don't push. Everyone knows where you stand. Pray and let it organically develop.
 
William, the signature issue in this matter is that our culture teaches that a Christian husband's main obligation is to keep his wife happy, while we hold that the bible teaches that a Christian husband's main obligation is to serve Christ, which may or may not please the wife, depending on where Christ is leading the man, who is supposed to then lead his family in that direction.

Among ourselves, we have different degrees of tolerance for arbitrary or over-the-objection-of-the-wife decision making. And even in one marriage, the "because I said so" meter will vary over time and in different contexts. But it is always preferable to lead by example and through patient instruction so that the wife submits to the husband willingly out of love for God and for the husband and not out of fear of consequences (from God or husband). If the wife digs in on a particular issue, though, and puts the husband in the position of having to choose between pleasing God and pleasing his wife, then that's when stuff gets real.

All that to say this: I haven't seen your exact fact situation before, but I have seen a handful of situations where the woman is nominally accepting of polygamy, but then she controls, or attempts to control, his choices. It takes time and a handful of test cases to determine whether those are sincere objections, or whether she's just always going to find some reason why this particular woman isn't the one. But the basic question is what God wants, not what the wife wants.

It seems odd to me, based on my experience, that the obvious woman who would be a great fit for your family should be passed over, while you search for some other woman not yet on your radar. Of course nobody wants you to tank the 3-way friendship over this, but that's a tactical issue, and it's certainly possible for y'all to have that conversation and stay friends, whether you decide to move in that direction or decide against it. And her specific circumstances give y'all plenty of time to work through whatever issues come up (and they will surely come up).

If I were you I would take the long view and start talking with your wife about developing the relationship without ruining the friendship. If she's open to some constructive dialogue on that topic, then y'all can solve the problems as you identify them. If she's not open to constructive dialogue, that would be some evidence that it's not the real issue for her, and she's using that as an argument-stopper to put the kibosh on the relationship without having to think about it, so you'd have to figure out how you're going to handle that.
 
William, welcome, and thank you for sharing your story.

I have some thought questions:

Has your wife ever expressed any distrust, dislike, threat, jealousy toward your friend, S, while the two of you have known her?

Would you say that the two women love and trust each other, going both ways?

Have you asked your wife what specifically she thinks will happen to their friendship if you go forward with S?
 
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Andrew your words are encouraging and appreciated. I feel fortunate that time is ample in my situation and careful guidance in the coming months and years could prove fruitful, Lord willing. It's often a roller coaster as I'm sure anyone going down this path has experienced. That being said, it isn't always clear knowing His plan, and the best I can do is pray and understand He will guide me. If it is His plan, it will come to pass. I often have to remind myself of that.

Ruthie said:
William, welcome, and thank you for sharing your story.

I have some thought questions:

Has your wife ever expressed any distrust, dislike, threat, jealousy toward your friend, S, while the two of you have known her?

Would you say that the two women love and trust each other, going both ways?

Have you asked your wife what specifically she thinks will happen to their friendship if you go forward with S?
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1) In isolated incidents yes, there has been jealousy. So here is what made S different from anyone else that made my mind start on this path. My wife is an extremely jealous woman. However the 2 of them would playfully talk about polygamy. We had a discussion, the 3 of us, about boundaries and I was astonished by my wife being ok with me spending time alone with S, holding hands and being close watching movies. Zero jealousy. G completely trusts me with S because we have discussed this all and they both know that celibacy is just as important to me as it is to S. They both understand that I will respect boundaries. Even when I told my wife I was developing romantic feelings she was completely understanding and had no jealousy.
That said, as we discussed it, there were times I got too pushy, and she would begin to wonder if I am in love with S, perhaps even more so than with my wife. I pondered the question and came up with the answer that I love S as a friend, and while I have feelings for her, to love her as a wife is not something I can claim yet. I love the idea of having more there, and am very clear in my desire to pursue it when the day comes. Then there would be instances where S talks about another man she likes, and I would express to my wife how that gave me feelings of jealousy. This jealousy felt similar to that of being jealous of my own wife, except it was for a woman I have no right to be jealous over. That again made my wife feel jealous as though I was more interested in S than her, as because I don't display jealousy very often. I was able to talk her through that and explain I do get jealous of my wife, however I know she is mine and I trust her to stay by me. Because of that I don't express jealousy over her when other men compliment her, more a sense of pride that she is my beautiful bride.
Then the hard one to cope with, and my wife is working past, is physical intimacy, and possible future children. This seems to be the big idea for a lot of women to get around regardless of faith. The idea that she is the only woman I have been with and she would no longer have that, but even bigger the idea that she wouldn't be the mother to some of my children. And I brought the topic of physical intimacy to her in a very real way when I described a dream I had. S and I didn't do anything, but in the dream she expressed desire to be mine physically. When I told my wife it took her awhile to cope with that possibility. Though in the end I believe she was able to use it as a test to work through the inevitable actions that would happen if we follow this course.

2) Entirely, part of what is great about our dynamic has been that S values open and honest communication above anything. Even when it's hard, if you have a problem address it head on logically and without attacking. So she has actually taught us a lot about being honest, and not attacking eachother for being honest in what should be a safe conversation. With that, there are some small quarrels that result from misunderstandings, but they are usually dealt with quickly and with love.

3) She is afraid that we start courting, things don't work out as I know they sometimes don't (that's why we court vs marry on sight!). And sometimes people have really bad breakups, she is afraid that she would lose her best friend if things don't work out. On the flip side, she thinks if I find someone else, there is the potential gain of another best friend/sister, without the risk that if I broke up with another woman of losing S as a friend. She see's more to gain by me finding another woman, and more to lose by courting S.

Edit to add, the big recurring theme here is much like another member posted a few months back about jealousy, and that in the end it's not truly jealousy of someone, but the fear of loss.
 
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andrew said:
All that to say this: I haven't seen your exact fact situation before, but I have seen a handful of situations where the woman is nominally accepting of polygamy, but then she controls, or attempts to control, his choices. It takes time and a handful of test cases to determine whether those are sincere objections, or whether she's just always going to find some reason why this particular woman isn't the one. But the basic question is what God wants, not what the wife wants.
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Andrew,
I was considering your words and wanted to zero in on this line in particular with a question. By test cases, what exactly are you suggesting?
 
So, if all goes well and you find another woman to be your wife, you then have G's blessing and can then add S and K and.... later. Sounds great to me.

Seriously though, God has specifically given the man the responsibility to lead his family. It's not to be a tyrannical dictator; a despot, but one who goes before, who sets the course and direction, and ensures their safety. Chart the right course, according to God's Word, and lead your family.

Thanks for your post and welcome to BF. Shalom
 
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William, thank you for answering the questions so thoroughly. It sounds like you have a good foundation of communication and working through things slowly with your wife concerning S. I wish you the best as you follow God's lead in leading your family:)
 
William said:
By test cases, what exactly are you suggesting?
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I just meant that a sample set of one doesn't give you much to work with. Your wife has only blackballed one woman so far, so it's hard to know what's going on in her head. But in some cases a couple can go through six or eight women and the wife always finds some reason it just "couldn't" work, and the man has it in his mind that he has to get his wife's buy-in or it's a no-go. Looks like a passive-aggressive pattern to me....
 
William said:
That again made my wife feel jealous as though I was more interested in S than her, as because I don't display jealousy very often. I was able to talk her through that and explain I do get jealous of my wife, however I know she is mine and I trust her to stay by me. Because of that I don't express jealousy over her when other men compliment her, more a sense of pride that she is my beautiful bride.
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I just thought this was a really beautiful way of explaining the jealousy you had over S but not over your wife. I think that that was a great reassuring thing to say. :)
 
Jealousy is the green-eyed monster here.
I’m guessing that it is being held in check towards S because G has the control. As long as you accept the restrictions, the demon can be kept in the closet.
Andrew is right in that the truth will come out in future relationships, but what really stinks is that you will wind up screwing with other women’s lives in order to prove it.
 
steve said:
Andrew is right in that the truth will come out in future relationships, but what really stinks is that you will wind up screwing with other women’s lives in order to prove it.
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Yeah, I absolutely did not mean to imply that you're supposed to just give your wife the benefit of the doubt until she's racked up five or six "thumbs down" responses. Rather, use a discussion about ways you could advance the relationship WITHOUT derailing the friendship to find out now whether your wife is sincerely hung up on the friendship or just looking for a convenient deal breaker.
 
I’d like to share- I have a friend that I thought about asking her if I died would she take care of my kids for my husband and consider marrying him. Then I realized why not now. Why not be part of the family now? Then the fear of loosing such a fun, free spirited friend hit me. Needless to say I wanted to keep her MY friend then risk loosing her if things didn’t work out between she and hubby. But it’s fear and selfishness that ruled my thoughts. After a bit of prayer and fear and love verse searching, as well as with Gods help- perfect love casteth out all fear. My love and trust of these two people is what finally settled my heart and mind. Whatever God wants with them, whatever they choose will just have to play out. I may loose a friend, she may gain a family. There’s no fear of loss anymore. BUT it had to be brought to my attention that I trusted her with my family and fear of loss had to be cast out. It’s funny to realize it wasn’t losing my husband to her that I feared but losing my friendship with her that was the issue.
 
Well loved wife said:
I’d like to share- I have a friend that I thought about asking her if I died would she take care of my kids for my husband and consider marrying him. Then I realized why not now. Why not be part of the family now? Then the fear of loosing such a fun, free spirited friend hit me. Needless to say I wanted to keep her MY friend then risk loosing her if things didn’t work out between she and hubby. But it’s fear and selfishness that ruled my thoughts. After a bit of prayer and fear and love verse searching, as well as with Gods help- perfect love casteth out all fear. My love and trust of these two people is what finally settled my heart and mind. Whatever God wants with them, whatever they choose will just have to play out. I may loose a friend, she may gain a family. There’s no fear of loss anymore. BUT it had to be brought to my attention that I trusted her with my family and fear of loss had to be cast out. It’s funny to realize it wasn’t losing my husband to her that I feared but losing my friendship with her that was the issue.
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While Andrew points out a possibility, I do firmly believe that this is the line of thought my wife is on as well. Putting names and faces to a potential other woman may show otherwise, but I am confident that it's this fear of losing her one good friend that is causing doubts. And as stated, she has become my best friend as well, so it is a sentiment I share. The word I liked that one of the men shared earlier was 'tactics'. There is risk, but there is time to take things slow and mitigate those risks, so if things don't work out romantically, the friendship can go on.
 
William said:
The word I liked that one of the men shared earlier was 'tactics'.
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andrew said:
It seems odd to me, based on my experience, that the obvious woman who would be a great fit for your family should be passed over, while you search for some other woman not yet on your radar. Of course nobody wants you to tank the 3-way friendship over this, but that's a tactical issue, and it's certainly possible for y'all to have that conversation and stay friends, whether you decide to move in that direction or decide against it. And her specific circumstances give y'all plenty of time to work through whatever issues come up (and they will surely come up).

If I were you I would take the long view and start talking with your wife about developing the relationship without ruining the friendship.
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Yeah, either way, your move right now is to honestly and openly address your wife's concerns. The subsequent conversation about how that would discover whether she was sincere or not wasn't supposed to overshadow the basic direction. Key word is 'address'—not pacify, or show her why she's wrong, or whatever, but actually work through the issue to where you guys are going in to this as a united team with a heads up approach to NOT screwing up two great friendships.

That also gives you a context in which to evaluate any plans you're making or ideas you're considering: (a) Don't mess up your relationship with your wife, and now (b) don't mess up the friendships you both have with, well, your friend!
 
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