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Meat WHY is polygyny so important?

PeteR

PeteR

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An interesting statement /question was posed by @Communication in the Poly Memes thread. His quote is:

Communication said:
I think I may not only speak for myself when I say that this game is played with high stakes, and the potential payoff, both to the Kingdom and the individual have a poorly defined advantage over church tradition. Basically I am saying that someone telling me I should put all my money in the lottery because over a dozen people won the jackpots last year has questionable reasoning. To what extent is that true of the promotion of the poly lifestyle?
Now, much of this website promotes poly through the larger lens of living lives in obedience to God and God only. And through that lens, my previous question is meaningless. But this website is not primarily about rejecting man's traditions, but rather a specific tradition, so that motivates my question.
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Indeed, we beat around this bush often, but rarely nail this down, likely because it seems so obvious to the hardcore believers in poly. I wrote a paper a couple years ago titled Why Poly? Why Now? that covers a number of fundamental reasons, but this would a good place to list, again, Why!

Please add to, or articulate some reasons why thus is so important. Here are a few that immediately come to mind.

1. TRUTH! Yeshua/Jesus castigated the Pharisees for not knowing their Scriptures and for nullifying commandments with elavated traditions. Monogamy is a tradition that violates TRUTH. How many men, women, families, ministries, etc have been destroyed because of the M-O tradition (lie)? I know numerous pastors, righteous men with hearts of real concern, that got 'involved' with a single woman and the resultant trainwreck due to false tradition destroyed lives. Pisses me off....

2. Benefit to society - Reduces number of single moms, fatherless households, criminals (high percentage from broken/fatherless homes), and reduces financial burden to society.

3. Benefits women by opening many quality options to them.. ALL men are available candidates for a husband, careermineed women can have a homemaking sisterwife to help care for children, homefront, etc

4. Men can build wealth, family, power blocks, etc (this is why Aristotle favored monogamy... he said it was the foundation of the polis, aka State.)

5. Scripture and prophecy cannot be understood correctly until one understands and accepts poly... marinate on that.. :D

Many more, but these are good starters. Please add to the list develop thoughts, etc...

Finally, here's one video in a series I did that enumerates some advantages...

 
steve said:
Let’s take the conversation elsewhere and leave the meme thread for its intended purpose.
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Dadgum!
Ask and I shall receive!
 
is the prophesy reference the idea of God having two wives? Do these two wives share the same marriage covenant, or is there a different covenant for each (different) marriage? I honestly haven't studied that very much, and I think they might have had different covenants, one being unlike the Mosaic covenant and superior in the ways that it echoes the Abrahamic covenant instead. That has prophetic elements that are fulfilled in Christ. I really value the prophesies whose fulfilment indicates the unity of Scripture and confirms the life, death and resurrection of Jesus as The Good News.
Conversely, I don't understand the high value placed on understanding future prophesy, it seems like it adds nothing to the essential understanding Christ has definitively provided regarding sin and salvation.
 
actually, sorry, i think that I responded to an issue that is only tangentially related to this thread. Looking at that post, it is not really belonging in the overall topic of this thread.
anyway, I do think poly could have benefits, and all of you have helped open my eyes to them, so honestly, thank you. I doubt it will be a path I will go down, but it has been edifying to think about.
 
Communication said:
I do think poly could have benefits
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Single women who can’t find an honorable covering can be very benefited by it.
It’s not always about the guy.
 
Communication said:
is the prophesy reference the idea of God having two wives? Do these two wives share the same marriage covenant, or is there a different covenant for each (different) marriage? I honestly haven't studied that very much, and I think they might have had different covenants, one being unlike the Mosaic covenant and superior in the ways that it echoes the Abrahamic covenant instead. That has prophetic elements that are fulfilled in Christ. I really value the prophesies whose fulfilment indicates the unity of Scripture and confirms the life, death and resurrection of Jesus as The Good News.
Conversely, I don't understand the high value placed on understanding future prophesy, it seems like it adds nothing to the essential understanding Christ has definitively provided regarding sin and salvation.
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So that this thread doesn't go sideways, I'll give the short answer and then if you want to discuss thus aspect further, we can do that in the Hebrew roots/Messianic section...

Does God have two brides? explains the basic overview. God viewed Ephraim and Judah as two separate sister brides at Mt Sinai. Ez. 23:3 They had the same covenant with the same promises. God had a purpose in handling each thevway He did (divorced Israel, kept Judah), but His stated intent, throughout the prophets, is to bring the two back together. Is. 11:13. Then Ez. 37, especially 15-28, detailed this reunification...

Truly, all of Scripture is a polygynous love story. God and His two bride... one divorced that wants to return ( and He made a way, but she wants to negotiate the terms) and another who stayed in the house, but wants to keep the repentant divorcée out and wants to love her husband in her own way, not as He requests...



 
Understanding polygyny, and especially that it is righteous, gives clarity to passages such as Hebrews Capter 11. Many of the great men of faith listed in that chapter had more than one woman/wife. If living with a plurality of women broke the commandment against adultery (Ex. 20:14) then these men could not be righteous examples of the faith. Passages such as e.g. 1 Cor. 6:9-10 and Rev. 21:8 are very clear that adulterers and the like will not inherit the eternal blessings God promises. Living a polygynous life identifies with and testifies to the righteousness of those great men of the faith, and to the continuity of Scripture; it's living out the truth of the Word of God.
 
PeteR said:
5. Scripture and prophecy cannot be understood correctly until one understands and accepts poly
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frederick said:
Understanding polygyny, and especially that it is righteous, gives clarity to passages such as Hebrews Capter 11. Many of the great men of faith listed in that chapter had more than one woman/wife. If living with a plurality of women broke the commandment against adultery (Ex. 20:14) then these men could not be righteous examples of the faith. Passages such as e.g. 1 Cor. 6:9-10 and Rev. 21:8 are very clear that adulterers and the like will not inherit the eternal blessings God promises.
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As stated above, understanding it makes the scripture less confusing.

God is not being arbitrary when he does not punish his saints when they take additional women. He doesn't punish them because it isn't sinful!

I have a lot less gymnastics to do if I just accept PM as lawful.

Who doesn't want a more consistent scripture?
 
PeteR said:
careermineed women can have a homemaking sisterwife to help care for children,
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Every woman should take care of her child, and every child should take care of its mother. This strengthens the bond between mother and child. If a woman cannot take care of her future children then she should not have one.

And this can relativize the concept of "mother". Society has messed up the concept of parenting. Parenting is no longer related to blood, but to "feelings". So many people would think that it is right to take a child from its mother. But none of this has biblical support.
 
When a family raises a child, it isn’t being removed from its mother.
But I would agree that an infant would be best off being nurtured by its mother.
 
Yan said:
Every woman should take care of her child, and every child should take care of its mother. This strengthens the bond between mother and child. If a woman cannot take care of her future children then she should not have one.
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I see your remarks as a buttress for the concept of plural marriage. With a larger familial network it allows for more opportunities on lots of levels from education to career development to the obvious big one...motherhood.

I wonder at times about the public at large and their poor understanding of the advantages inherent to polygyny, much less just how many of those advantages accrew to women. Instead apparently the advantages go only one direction and involve slaking the lust and desire to be waited on by silent unthinking women.
Lame, boring and lazy thinking.
 
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steve said:
Single women who can’t find an honorable covering can be very benefited by it.
It’s not always about the guy.
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I understand how correct understanding of any aspect of what God expects from his people can have a correlation to understanding scripture and prophesy (point 5 of OP), but I believe that this point can me made in a way which elevates the docrine of poly higher than it should be. As this website is a community of people who may be inclined to celebrate this aspect of a potentially godly life, such an elevation would not be an inconcievable error.
I replied to steve specifically with the quote above because I have heard this idea of a husband or father being an "honorable covering."
I belive what Jesus accomplished on the cross and through his life is sufficient for every human. I assume everyone here agrees with that.
What I feel needs to be said is: I have seen the word "covering" being used as if it added something to (specifically a woman's) salvation.
 
Communication said:
What I feel needs to be said is: I have seen the word "covering" being used as if it added something to (specifically a woman's) salvation.
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Can't say I've ever read or heard anyone asserting such a thing, @Communication. Given that you chose to address this concern here, could you please provide an example? Or, at the very least, keep your powder dry until you come across such an example of people asserting that covering is necessary for covering. In the absence of that, I'm going to consider it a red herring.

I think we're more likely to find examples of pebbles in our sandals.
 
Communication said:
I understand how correct understanding of any aspect of what God expects from his people can have a correlation to understanding scripture and prophesy (point 5 of OP), but I believe that this point can me made in a way which elevates the docrine of poly higher than it should be. As this website is a community of people who may be inclined to celebrate this aspect of a potentially godly life, such an elevation would not be an inconcievable error.
I replied to steve specifically with the quote above because I have heard this idea of a husband or father being an "honorable covering."
I belive what Jesus accomplished on the cross and through his life is sufficient for every human. I assume everyone here agrees with that.
What I feel needs to be said is: I have seen the word "covering" being used as if it added something to (specifically a woman's) salvation.
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Dude, this is a load of garbage.
There is no doctrine of poly, read your Bible. There is no classification for the number of wives that a man has. Marriage is marriage. The only doctrine is the false doctrine of monogamy only.
As far as covering, Yah made women for men. To be his help. Nothing about Yeshua’s death on the cross changed that. It didn’t make single motherhood suddenly respectable.
And the nonsense about salvation as part of covering, you are saddling us with Mormon theology.

Read your Bible and leave off with chiding us with the traditions of man.
 
As to the accusation that we overly elevate poly, have you honestly looked over this site?
The vast majority of what is discussed has absolutely nothing to do with poly, much to the chagrin of people that want it focused on poly.
 
ok thanks, steve, for that. i think you misunderstand me, or at least my intent. you got a lot of wisdom, and i wouldn't be here if i didn't believe that. we may have disagreements and it might be helpful to understand each other with a spirit of generosity so we can together respond to the grace of God.
 
steve said:
As to the accusation that we overly elevate poly, have you honestly looked over this site?
The vast majority of what is discussed has absolutely nothing to do with poly, much to the chagrin of people that want it focused on poly.
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I so agree! Most of what gets said around here is stuff that helps to make us better Christians and better people. We also have some fun things on here and that's great because that means we get to have our fun in this community instead of having to go somewhere else for it!
 
MeganC said:
I will say that when Christie died she left five children behind and although they lost their mother they are not motherless. And Steve is not a single parent trying to raise4 them.
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Very much part of what I had in mind. If a child (the most important part of marriage to my mind) looses a parent then there is more support there for the child and the remaining parent(s).
 
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