I would posit that defrauding is a heart issue as opposed to a distance issue.
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The Long-Distance Wife
- Thread starter crsivils
- Start date
As ANYONE who has ever discussed 'polygyny' from Scripture has heard ad nauseam.
They just won't usually READ what the Bible has to say about that aspect, either.
I agree that defrauding is a heart issue, but there also seems to be a principle that regular intercourse is the normal pattern for marriage. There are times and seasons where that isn't possible. In addition each man and woman will vary in his or her needs. Some people can deal with physical separation better than others.
I think this is a Biblical red flag, but not a Biblical deal breaker.
Look at Salmon marrying Rahab. The fact that she was a former harlot was probably a red flag for Salmon. The fact that she feared YAHWEH enough to betray her people and city to save the spies was a huge positive indicator. The fact that their son Boaz turned out to be a very godly man is an indicator Salmon made a good choice when he took Rahab.
Go ahead and design your perfect life, but please try to avoid throwing shade on others who have less than perfect circumstances.
I won't try to comment on the biblical aspect but we all know that long distance wives...frequently secret long distance wives are a thing within the Muslim faith. Probably all faiths but it is an easy example to point at.
The scenario you paint at the beginning is quite appealing and describes more or less dead bang my own vision and goals. The second portion with respect to the distant wife however seems gut wrenching. I suppose some could manage it...I can easily imagine the how to with respect to using technology to try to integrate a distant family member into the group in an ersatz make do fashion. I just can't imagine it being used for a long term situation and being happy. I have a far easier time imagining if one of the wives or husband had a job that forced them to travel frequently, having the laptop or phone setup in the hotel room while perhaps working or having dinner etc but with the normal big family semi organized chaos goes on to hear and see via Webcam. Maybe active chatting part of the time but more than anything just the noise and warmth of the family still being available while away.
Maybe others would be comfortable with a long distance relationship with occasional visits. I know people have made it work but on a personal level, I would be a poor candidate for it beyond the more advanced courting part of a relationship. It could only be as a stopgap measure and not a long term solution.
Part of it as I think about it a bit that makes me hesitant over and above the notion of not all being the one big family together is that it smacks of having a mistress rather than a wife. I understand that is not the example scenario, that it is an additional plural wife just at a distance...but the more I think about it, the stronger the notion is in my mind.
Being an increasingly healthy high testosterone adult male I can see the libertine appeal of just nipping off for a few days every few weeks to some woman far away to try to cram in as many adult shenanigans as humanity possible in the short time...but that just doesn't feel like marriage. It feels like taking a vacation from wives and children and day to day life.
I like the idea of the day to day life of a man with skads of crumb crunchers and rugrats with women I love and all of the average problems and joys of a plural family. Don't think I would want or can imagine having time in the literal sense or in the mental energy sense for a huge chunk of your emotional life off to the side at a distance or as a part time marriage.
Maybe the other guys feel differently but I haven't read anyone's remarks on the topic so far. They would have to have very different feelings on the issue than me though.
The God given wise instructions of Paul in 1st Cor. 7 must be seriously considered. The situation @crsivils asked about is Biblically problematic. The woman doesn't really seem to want to be a proper wife. It might possibly work out, but I highly doubt it.
A lot of polygamous (and monogamous) relationships fail. We should try to do the best we can.
Saaaaaaay....that is good to know. I may need that along with 1st Timothy 4 on a t-shirt.
Ladies...who wants a shirt?
Different suits (save for what people would call politics but it is in reality understanding facts vs propaganda and gaslight) me fine. In point of fact, it would suit me down to the ground to meet a well organized Type A woman. I can easily see the advantages...very much as Megan reports from her own family.
Glad it works for y'all but I would have a very difficult time with that situation and have turned down higher paying jobs that would require me to manage business in all the Texas metro areas and a few surrounding states...and that meant about 50% of my time away.
Y'all remember the show from back in the (probably) 70's or 80's where psychologists in horn rim glasses and lab coats stood around a new born baby monkey that the separated from its mother. It was experiencing tonnes of anxiety obviously but being creepy guys in lab coats doing their experiment, they had a solution. A dummy made from carpet, chicken wire, something like a sock monkey face/head, something for warmth and a ticking clock as a heart beat was provided as a mother substitute. Then the little monkey not knowing better was soothed and presumably the creepy dorks in lab coats high fived each other for proving something obvious to a recent romper room alumni.
The point of that odd aside is that I would be like that freaked out little monkey with weeks of separation from wives and home.
Different strokes though
I would say that a man to oversee and manage decisions, talk to and share with, and get to spend time with "in person," is far better then not having a man at all. It is marriage, of course they are wives of @steve and that is 100% better then if they were alone.
Not everyone can do that though, and my hubby's sentiments would run more along the lines of what @paterfamilias has expressed. He's the kind of guy that goes fishing with his brother for a few days...but only lasts one day and comes home early!
Not everyone can do that though, and my hubby's sentiments would run more along the lines of what @paterfamilias has expressed. He's the kind of guy that goes fishing with his brother for a few days...but only lasts one day and comes home early!
I heard years ago that before the establishment of the Trans-Siberian Railway, when transport along that very long route in Russia was by cart, it was not uncommon for a driver to have a wife and home at both ends of the route. They'd know about each other, even send each other gifts, but rarely if ever meet. And that was practical.
Gideon had a concubine in Shechem, a town he didn't live in (Judges 8:31). Now, that didn't actually work out well for his family if you read on, the son presumably had too little interaction with his father and turned out to be a bad egg, so that is not a positive recommendation as to whether it's a good idea. But it does show it's permissible.
I also have always presumed that Solomon's many concubines were not all kept in a single harem, which would be a major cost to maintain. I assume they staffed his various palaces and other properties all around his kingdom, doing all the domestic work to keep the places running - and wherever he went he had company in his bed. Then they would be a great benefit to him rather than a cost. Scripture does not say how he managed his household, but from a purely practical perspective this seems logical. I would therefore presume that Solomon had many remote concubines - and the same is likely true of most kings and other wealthy people historically with a reasonably large number of wives and multiple residences. It's also worth noting that this didn't go badly for Solomon, as it was not his concubines who led him astray.
It's permissible. Whether it's wise is entirely dependent on the circumstances.
Gideon had a concubine in Shechem, a town he didn't live in (Judges 8:31). Now, that didn't actually work out well for his family if you read on, the son presumably had too little interaction with his father and turned out to be a bad egg, so that is not a positive recommendation as to whether it's a good idea. But it does show it's permissible.
I also have always presumed that Solomon's many concubines were not all kept in a single harem, which would be a major cost to maintain. I assume they staffed his various palaces and other properties all around his kingdom, doing all the domestic work to keep the places running - and wherever he went he had company in his bed. Then they would be a great benefit to him rather than a cost. Scripture does not say how he managed his household, but from a purely practical perspective this seems logical. I would therefore presume that Solomon had many remote concubines - and the same is likely true of most kings and other wealthy people historically with a reasonably large number of wives and multiple residences. It's also worth noting that this didn't go badly for Solomon, as it was not his concubines who led him astray.
It's permissible. Whether it's wise is entirely dependent on the circumstances.
I would venture to guess that David didn’t have his wives with him and his band of merry men as they hid in the rough places from King Saul.
He took Abigail as wife during that time, but most likely left her running the estate. Popping in for a visit now and again.
He took Abigail as wife during that time, but most likely left her running the estate. Popping in for a visit now and again.
This made me chuckle a bit.
One of my grandfathers was in large scale construction and worked all over the world for many months to a couple of years at a time.
Not all that long after he died, my father received a letter from Panama. Apparently he had a younger half brother down there.
When it was discussed with my grandmother, she didn't even blink. She matter a factly said "oh, you have brothers all over, don't worry though, he always married their moms". Apparently she was aware/up to speed. I don't know how he handled things with these other women unfortunately.
Not sure what to think about it one way or the other. I just don't have enough information. I certainly am curious about the uncles I have out there and feel sorry for them growing up without their father.
It also helps to confirm my own convictions about methods of practicing polygamy of various stripes. One family. All together with the advantage of multiple moms and their father present in their lives and participating in their rearing.
David only had a couple wives at the time (Ahinoam, Abigail, and technically Michal but she wasn't there). It seems like the two wives generally were with him when he was fleeing Saul. Saul wasn't above harming David's family. Even David's aged parents had to flee to the wilderness with him.
Do you have a reference for that?
Reminds me of a guy I met a few years ago at a school (class) reunion. Each person stood and gave a brief testimony about their life since finishing school. They all had the usual story; left school, worked, married, kids, (more than a few) divorced, blah, blah. Then this one guy stood up, and after covering the basics, said he works on ships and has six wives and kids. Depending on where he's waiting for his ship in a port he stays with that wife. He got a lot of hoots and shouts of congratulations from the others after he finished. I took the opportunity and had an excellent discussion with him afterwards about his situation biblically. It was a great time at this reunion and opened some doors to present the case for polygyny. It also highlighted the variety of situations people have for their relationships.
I think if my husband needed to travel a lot for work, I'd sure rather he have a wife to keep him company and provide homely comforts. I'd love to know he was well fed, well embraced, each night.
You made me curious, so I went back and checked some things in 1st Samuel.
I was wrong about David's parents. It seems like his whole family did come to him in the wilderness (chapter 22), but David took his parents to Moab where the king of Moab provided them with sanctuary for the duration.
David married Ahinoam and Abigail in chapter 25 when he is in the wilderness of Paran. Later on we remember that they were all in the city of Ziklag.
Well, that requires inference and places too much hypothetical power, authority and influence into an equation that is much more determined by the personhood of the individual and his YHWH-created DNA than it can be laid on the shoulders of any father -- although, as the father of six I certainly comprehend the impulse toward believing otherwise while one is still in the midst of raising-up shepherding.
Gênesis 2:18 And YHWH God says, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I make him a helper as his opposite.” (Kenegdo = As opposite)
God created man and woman with separate roles.
1 Timothy 2:15
and she will be saved through the childbearing, if they remain in faith, and love, and sanctification, with sobriety.
Genesis 3:16 is similar to 4:7,
is about the man not allowing himself to be deceived/seduced into error by the woman.