Negative.
Only that hierarchy is natural. There is always difference in status. Then patriarchy will come naturally.
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So... What are your arguments FOR polygyny?
Only that hierarchy is natural. There is always difference in status. Then patriarchy will come naturally.
Any statistics to show that?
I think @MemeFan has a good point, in that a patriarchal hierarchy will be naturally imposed in a tribal situation, simply because men are physically stronger. However in times of plenty, patriarchy naturally fades - the same happened in the Roman empire during its decline. Patriarchy is not the natural state of a society at the stage in the cycle that the West is in - but it may be the natural state of the society that emerges after the inevitable collapse.
Patriachy is natural because human society by its nature is hierarhical and because women prefer men with greater status than her own.
Current problems comes from belief in egalitarism. Men and women are completly same with few small unimportant biological differences.
Current problems comes from belief in egalitarism. Men and women are completly same with few small unimportant biological differences.
Agreed - but egalitarianism may be the natural state of a late-stage society.
There are no statistics, only logic.
Do you know any relationship which isn't hierarhical? Hierarchy is sometimes obvious like employee/employeer. But even non-obvious relationships are hierarchical.
Person who has stronger hand will have more power which means he/she will create rules.
Off course, in long term rules must be benefical for both parties.
To achieve egalitarism in practice new unnatural hierarchies must be created. People who would otherwise have lower status must have its status raised.
Which is probably one of the reason late-stage societies are unstable, and ultimately collapse.
Related information about societies rise and fall in relation to patriarchy.
"In every one of the 80+ cultures, the author found a 100% correlation between the ability/opportunity of people to have sex outside of marriage and the civilization’s level of sophistication. Those who have taken statistics know that a 100% correlation almost always indicates cause-and-effect.
It was true 100% of the time; no exceptions. It seems that pre-marital chastity and post-marital fidelity are required for a great civilization to exist. In every single culture – no matter how advanced or primitive – the facts remained the same."
"The event precipitating the fall of every great civilization in history was the emancipation of women, making them the full legal, social, and political equals of men."
Some will say: “But wait, women today have more freedom and equality than ever before.” Actually, that’s not the case. From Sex and Culture:
"In every one of the 80+ cultures, the author found a 100% correlation between the ability/opportunity of people to have sex outside of marriage and the civilization’s level of sophistication. Those who have taken statistics know that a 100% correlation almost always indicates cause-and-effect.
- The more people had sex outside of marriage, the more the civilization declined
- The less people had sex outside of marriage, the more the civilization flourished
It was true 100% of the time; no exceptions. It seems that pre-marital chastity and post-marital fidelity are required for a great civilization to exist. In every single culture – no matter how advanced or primitive – the facts remained the same."
"The event precipitating the fall of every great civilization in history was the emancipation of women, making them the full legal, social, and political equals of men."
Some will say: “But wait, women today have more freedom and equality than ever before.” Actually, that’s not the case. From Sex and Culture:
How Getting Marriage 'Wrong' Destroyed Every Great Civilization in World History - Berean Patriot
The title makes a bold claim, but it’s one that this article will prove. We’ll end someplace that most people probably won’t expect, but that’s where we must end because it’s where the facts lead. (I had to alter some long-held beliefs while researching it.) This is the first part of an article...
www.bereanpatriot.com
My marriage is based on a Ketubah. I negotiated with my wife for marriage, and when we had settled most of the problems that will come up,l we solidified the promises and then got married.My husband and I were recently revealed the truth about Polygyny. So I don't need to be convinced the truth, I am curious about how you would try to shine light on others that don't know or believe in polygyny though.
I am also wondering how others found out about it and what your arguments are for supporting Polygyny even if you're not trying to convince someone haha.
Preferably Biblical Argumentsbut open to what ever you think should be shared!
Thanks for reading!
I am the head of the family. This is a job I can TAKE, but it's far better as a job that's granted. I see it as a job and a duty. My decisions affect two people's lives and I make them after careful thought. She doesn't like my decisions occasionally, but she willingly placed me in this position and she has to support me. She knows this, and does so even when she disagrees.
I ALWAYS want to hear her disagreements. I always want her to argue with me. I always want her to point out when she thinks I'm screwing up, because it makes me a better leader. That input is precious to me. If she is dead set against something, I may change my mind, and that's good as well. Because I occasionally do something she completely disagrees with, I have to have her TRUST. I also have to know that when it comes time to make an unpleasant decision, she will argue and then, after I've decided, fall in line and help me accomplish it.
My job is MY job. I do the cooking, maintain the vehicles, any building, repairs or construction. I also fold the clothes. I did take the trash out, but she had so much of a problem with how I did it that she started nagging me... so now, she takes it out. She took my job and I'm done with it. There is a reason for this. It's MY job, and I choose how to do it. If I stop, and she decides to take the job, then it's her job from then on. The reason for this is that it stops arguments. Arguments are almost always about the other person doing a certain job a certain way - or about that job and who does it. There is no examples that I can rely on where there are two leaders, it's not the way the world works. If someone has a job, then they are the leader in that job. They can ask for help and I always give it. They can ask me to do it for a while, and that's fine, too. But it's always HER job, not mine. I have to respect that. Now, note and important and all that stuff... Doing someone's job without them asking or wanting you to do it, is wrong. Dead wrong. It has long term consequences and it literally rips the rug out from under her confidence. You can take a wonderful woman and turn her into a bitter hate filled woman in a matter of DAYS by trying to do her jobs for her.
My JOB also as the leader of the family is the safety, security, and viability of the family. Safety in teaching my wife to defend herself, security in that we are financially stable and I make the call when I need her to work to help with an issue, and viability and that's a big one. Viability means that the family is balanced. A balanced family is an educated family. Education is paramount to me, it means school, college if needed, talents skills sets, and constant betterment. That betterment is always on the front of my mind... I host a writers club and have the equivelent of a masters in English, and am a skilled photographer, woodworker and can fix nearly anything with a motor. My wife has a bachelors in Art, and since we've been together she's been constantly learning new skills. She can now build a chicken coop from rough lumber, can tell you almost every breed of chicken out there, and now can even skin a dead animal (we're working on that) and is learning to use cameras, and is getting really good with the tractor. Each thing I teach her, each thing she learns makes is stronger. She's on her third guitar lesson, as well... But all of this is planned out.
HER job is HER job. If I do her job, then I am wrong. As head of the family, I CAN say, "Hey, I need you to do this job, it's keeping me from..." But I cannot do it FOR her unless she asks me, and I cannot do it FOR her at all if she doesn't want me to - unless I want to take that job over, completely. Because anything else is going to cause harm and undercut her confidence in the family and that is a bad bad bad bad bad thing. Even taking something over will leave bitterness. It makes her feel like a failure. I would rather offer tons and tons of support and help when asked, not to do it for her, but to help her do it for herself. Tasks done are tasks to be proud of.
Now, you are probably wondering what this is all about. And it's the answer to your question. This is one of the biggest arguments FOR polygamy that I know. When THIS way of living is utilized and the arguments stop, so does the bitterness, resentment, arguments, anger, and most importantly, living this way can reduce divorces dramatically. It teaches children to rely on common sense instead of emotion. Which brings me to my last thing for this answer... Love. I don't care about Love. I loved my wife, but love does not make a relationship. Love is what gets two people to make googly eyes at each other, but love is not a thing to base ANY relationship on. It's stupid. Why?
See, Love is an emotion. Love waxes wand wanes. Love ebbs as much as the tide. Love Solves all Problems - NONSENSE. Love makes people want to get together, but you don't build a life on an emotion that will be strong on Monday, weak on Wednesday and Saturday ends with, "I HATE YOU! I'M GOING TO MOTHER'S HOUSE!" And to make it even worse, this false doctrine of, "If you don't love him anymore it's time to divorce..." HOGWASH! THiS is what you get when you base a marriage on love. Marriage has to be based on free will, she can stay, she can go, she's with you because she made the decision to be with you and you have a mutual agreement. A marriage relies on her keeping her word in good and bad times. It relies on him keeping his word in good and bad times. He's there of his own choice and his own free will nad can walk at any time he chooses - and he must keep the word he made, come thick and thin. Marriage isn't a trap, it's a contract that the two (or more) people agreed to. See that word? Agreed? Without an agreement, a plan, a design, a set of basic rules, a chain of command, responsibilities, then you have a marriage based on "Love."
That marriage based on love will last exactly as long as the feelings of love last. Which ain't long to a 19 year old.
I wish I could teach this to everyone who wants to get married. Polygyny taught me this. It needs to be handed down to monogamy.
My husband and I were recently revealed the truth about Polygyny. So I don't need to be convinced the truth, I am curious about how you would try to shine light on others that don't know or believe in polygyny though.
I am also wondering how others found out about it and what your arguments are for supporting Polygyny even if you're not trying to convince someone haha.
Preferably Biblical Arguments
Thanks for reading!
First found out about it watching the TV show Big Love back in the day. After that looking online and reading the arguments and studying the Bible for myself and it was not long before the truth became obvious.
The #1 thing to keep in mind is that the burden of proof is on the other side. They have to prove it is a sin. You do not have to prove that it is not a sin.
The #2 thing to keep in mind is what does the Bible call it when a man take another wife? The answer is "marriage" which is not a sin. That kind of colors the discussion and puts it on the right track. We only think of it as something different because of our cultural heritage. Biblically speaking there is no difference.
The word "polygamy" is a sociological word, not a Biblical word. If they want to say that it is a sin, they need to specify what sin it is. They might want to try to claim adultery. This is an opportunity to teach them what the true meaning of the Biblical term "adultery" means.
For details there are many books, essays online, Q&As, and FAQs about Biblical polygamy online. Some even listed on this web site in the resources section. Study it for yourself, read your Bible and come up with what your position is and then you will be prepared to give a reason for your faith when the time comes.
I think those who follow the Truth and Gods Will find themselves in the minority because of that. The bible says that the world will hate us because of our beliefs. Thus being freaks. I've been one for religious and moral beliefs foelr my whole life. I'm not saying we shouldn't use non-biblical arguments to try to persuade others in culture, just that the enemy has control over most of culture and those running it currently. We live in a world which is progressing further down the left hand path. We can start with sharing the truth to our immediate circle and share in as many ways as possible to influence the culture as we can. Fearing what the world thinks is not a reason to hide truth. But it has to be tempered by protecting your family first.
What about the strictly biological aspect, and the command to be fruitful and multiply? It's limited by biology in men from roughly 15 to 90 years of age, about 75 years. In women the age range is roughly 15 to 50, about 35 years and less than half the man's window. Could it be that Yah's intent was for the man to keep fathering children until he is no longer able, and when his first wife is no longer able to conceive, he is allowed, and expected, to acquire another wife (while maintaining his covenant with his first wife) to continue his primary mission of being fruitful and multiplying? Is there any other reason to have double the window? In addition, if the church were to acknowledge the primary mission to be fruitful and multiply as long as each is able, I would think polygyny would be much easier to accept. Right now, it is the monogamous wife who biologically determines when to stop having children. That problem was fixed in the past by him getting another wife, or the first wife giving him her handmaid.My husband and I were recently revealed the truth about Polygyny. So I don't need to be convinced the truth, I am curious about how you would try to shine light on others that don't know or believe in polygyny though.
I am also wondering how others found out about it and what your arguments are for supporting Polygyny even if you're not trying to convince someone haha.
Preferably Biblical Arguments
Thanks for reading!
Yes. As a matter of genetic selection, biology, and health of the population that could very well be true. I'll spare the long boring genetics explanation but it's a breeding strategy used with livestock and a very useful one for improving the gene pool.
Be fruitful and multiply!
"Be fruitful and multiply" is a command, and I believe it is a general one given to all mankind. It still applies to us today.
I don't however believe it is our primary directive. Our primary directive seems to be loving God with all our heart, mind, and strength. Multiplying is one way or application of loving God.
Loving God is never in question, neither are the two at odds with each other. Not sure why the word "primary" matters. It is one of the original commands, and men seem to be biologically designed to perform that function for the vast majority of their lives. The monogamy only crowd cuts the man's potential for loving God through that function in half or more.
Even where polygamy is practiced, math would seem to indicate that most men won't end up being polygamists. The supply of women isn't unlimited.
If a man marries a woman that is 18-22 years of age, and they have a child every couple of years, they will likely end up with 6-12 children during the years of her fertility. That is pretty reasonable multiplying fruitfulness.
As you suggest, the error of "monogamy only" is one negative factor.
The bigger problem is that the culture brainwashes people like your wife into only wanting one or two children instead of seeking greater fruitfulness.
We really need to fight that.
Men can father children for a very long relative period of time. We can also theoretically father an extremely large number of children (millions of sperm cells are produced every day).
Though it is biologically possible, that doesn't mean God intends most men to father thousands of children.
I think he gives us greater flexibility. We can marry later if necessary. We can also have more than one wife.
I agree that the amount of children he has should not be commensurate with the amount of sperm he produces. But even as in agriculture, not every seed produces fruit, and spacing is critical to the plants growth.
I also agree that not every man will be a polygynist. There are enough men in jail, gay, MGTOW, players, and "trans" to create an imbalance in ratio of godly men to christian seeking women. The church is filled with single women and single moms that are left out in the cold, that those of us who COULD take them on, and want to, should be allowed to.
I think we are on the same page, there just seems to be differences in how we view it's practicality.
In my situation, about 6-10 would be ideal.
A man should embrace every child he is blessed with, God has blessed him for a reason, he shouldn't turn from or try to prevent conception.
6-10 babies would be a dream come true for me!
Very much agree, and his woman should not be standing in the way of those blessings based on a 2500 year old antiquated Roman tradition designed to keep him subservient to the state.A man should embrace every child he is blessed with, God has blessed him for a reason, he shouldn't turn from or try to prevent conception.
6-10 babies would be a dream come true for me!