Ketubah

[Lysistrata]

Hi Folks,

From a previous post, Steve mentioned that we should bring up the subject of a Ketubah for incoming subsequent wives in plural marriages. There is concern among many of us that "bonus wives" are entering into plural marriages where they are being committed to and then dumped along the roadside. This happens when emotional turmoil from the first wife causes disharmony, or if their are other reasons why she is incompatible or displeasing to her family.

Here is Wikipedia's definition of a katubah. Yes, I understand that it is not a scholarly resource but it is in plain English.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketubah

The rabbis in ancient times insisted on the marriage couple entering into the ketubah as a protection for the wife. It acted as a replacement of the biblical mohar[1][2][3][4][5] - the price paid by the groom to the bride, or her parents, for the marriage (i.e., the bride price). The ketubah became a mechanism whereby the amount due to the wife (the bride-price) came to be paid in the event of the cessation of marriage, either by the death of the husband or divorce. It may be noted that the biblical mohar created a major social problem: many young prospective husbands could not raise the mohar at the time when they would normally be expected to marry. So, to enable these young men to marry, the rabbis, in effect, delayed the time that the amount would be payable, when they would be more likely to have the sum. The mechanism adopted was to provide for the mohar to be a part of the ketubah. It may also be noted that both the mohar and the ketubah amounts served the same purpose: the protection for the wife should her support (either by death or divorce) cease. The only difference between the two systems was the timing of the payment. A modern secular equivalent would be the entitlement to maintenance in the event of divorce. Another function performed by the ketubah amount was to provide a disincentive for the husband contemplating divorcing his wife: he would need to have the amount to be able to pay to the wife.

Are there legal scholars on this board who can help us with legal explanations and suggestions for setting up a modern day katubah? There needs to be a resource on the front page of this board for women who are planning on committing themselves to a family. They need to be protected. There need to be consequences for men who pick up an extra wife and simply dump her on her butt when she becomes an inconvenience.

As we mentioned earlier. Men have all of the incentive in the world to keep their first (legally protected) wife and cave in to her demands if she insists that the second wife go. Yes, the reason that this is happening is because people enter into unions too quickly; however, consequences make people think before they act. Wives would hesitate to leave their families too if there were real consequences. She would no longer get half of everything if the family split. She would get a third or a fourth or less depending on the number of wives in the union.

Thanks!

 

[steve]

great start, lysistrata (you need a nickname, i aint typin that'n much. lysis?)

i know that there is more to the ketubah then just this and we will explore it.

girls, when a friend says that she is getting married the first question should not be "what will your dress look like?" but "what does your ketubah look like?"

one thing that i have been thinking about is separate life insurance policies on the husband with each wife being the beneficiary of her own.
of course, that puts the pressure on us husbands to be worth more alive than dead :!:

 

[The Duke Of Marshall]

Definitely going to keep an eye on this thread. Even though I've been over this, it still fascinates me for some reason.

....of course, that puts the pressure on us husbands to be worth more alive than dead :!:

lol, That was the common joke when I was in the Marine Corps. We used to joke about how we were worth more dead than alive due to the 250K life insurance from the government, but extremely low salaries. We'd make more from dieing than from 10 years of service.

 

[Lysistrata]

Hey guys! You are worth more than 250k, or any amount of money, to your wives and your mothers!

Duke, has this been discussed in another thread? I would be interested to read over that thread. As a newcomer to this site, I noticed lots of encouragement for single mothers to join with families. Why is there a lack of guidance for those single mothers regarding how to safeguard themselves (AND THEIR CHILDREN) if this has been gone over on this board? I haven't found anything in the teaching articles. Shouldn't there be a flashing banner guiding women to an article to read first and foremost about the abuses that may take place in polygyny? Polygyny not only offers her up to abuse from a spouse but abuse from the spouse's spiteful and jealous wife or wives.

I can tell that there are strong Christian patriarchs among the men of this board. Why is there such a lack of concern for the new wives entering families? This is a new movement among Christian circles. Shouldn't this be the main topic on this board? Shouldn't this be the main focus of this group? First wives are protected! Second and subsequent wives are not. Since the moderators and creators of this board are in essence encouraging this typed of marriage, shouldn't their primary concern be for the well being of young women and young mothers with their children?

 

[The Duke Of Marshall]

Lysistrata,
I don't think this has been covered yet in this forum. I just remember talking about it in groups, face to face, and I know this is something that we touched on in the last retreat. Especially in the relation to Yahuweh's ketubah with us in the commandments. As the marriage to us. I don't really think this should be the main focus of the group. It certainly should be something that should be included. We do spend a lot of time on patriarchy and if we're doing our job in training up husbands and families in the way they should be scripturally then there really shouldn't be any need for a ketubah as everything will go as it should. But then again we live in a fallen world and as part of the patriarchy teaching we teach about treating ALL wives with respect and dedication and servant leadership, etc. If a man is being the scriptural type of man that he is supposed to be in submission to the Messiah and Yahuweh and he is being the leader he is supposed to be then the ketubah will fall right into place.

 

[ylop]

I like the concept of a clearly laid out agreement of the terms of the marriage. In fact I would not marry any additional wives without one. The formal commitment to the new wife in financial terms should be food for thought for potential husbands. I mean, this is marriage we are talking about here, not just living together. I should put a caveat here that I am also considering the flip-side of this, with a pre-nuptial agreement protecting the assets of both myself and my existing wife and children.

Now we can talk in generalities about this for ages, however I would like to nail down some specifics. I realise that everyone's personal position will vary, but here are my initial thoughts on what the new wife should get:

. Full health insurance coverage
. Life insurance cover on the husband
. Housing will be supplied
. Food and clothing will be supplied

And should promise to:
. Contribute to the household to the best of her ability (this could be in our business, or through childrearing, cooking, cleaning etc)
. Not make any claim on the husband's assets that existed prior to her marriage (not sure how this one would stand up in court)

Okay there is my initial list. I imagine it will change with time. How about you show me yours!

ylop

 

[Dr. K.R. Allen]

Lysistrata,

This was something I posted something similar about some time back (actually only a few days after joining the forums). It drew a lot of thoughts, even some tension.

I'll post it here and you can read through it and see what you think.

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1698&hilit=Contract

I'll also add that to the list I have of requested articles in the teaching articles.

I have shared with the men at the last retreat, to which I think Todd referenced, that upon my covenant union there will be this type of set up and there will be some men spelled out in a formal written covenant who will have rights to get involved in the union if problems begin to arise and the individual parties cannot get it resolved by the Matthew 18 process. At that point others would be brought into help with a binding contract stipulation in that written covenant.

The problem this movement has though is that many times men are in the spirit of anarchy and they are unwilling to submit to another set of godly men or believers. Sometimes this is because they have been hurt and booted out by church leaders. They have been burned and thus they do not like or see the need to submit to others. That is one reason. At times though is is simply pride though and the natural sinful drive of not wanting to submit to anyone over them.

The best I can suggest to any woman today, and I do VERY OFTEN in counseling, is to tell a woman if your potential man cannot be a disciple of another and if you do not see him submitting to another man's leadership then he is probably way to immature to be in a covenant union with to begin with. A man who cannot submit to another man is likely a man who is not truly submitted to Christ.

In my years of counseling this has proven to be more true than what I would like as I have seen many homes come to ruin because the man is too prideful to place himself under the authority of another or several others (such as with under a plural body of elders).

In the early church the NT elders handled these disputes (see 1 Cor. 6). Also Bill Luck has also suggested something to the staff here that might be on the agenda of discussion this year in due time that has a similar tone to the idea being discussed here. We ran into a problem this year that led us to see the need again for something like this. But specifics and details as to the best way is a legitimate debate and not an easy one to resolve or put into place where it is required with strength behind it to make it so.

But, with due respect to the other side of the argument, there is a legitimate issue as to who is truly mature enough to be that set of leaders. In many places the leaders would counsel to divorce and thus they would not be of much help. So sometimes it is not a matter of pride but a matter of protection by the head against harmful outside sources that try to harm the family.

The family head is indeed the man. Thus it is SO CRUCIAL FOR THE LADY TO WATCH OVER TIME HOW THAT MAN AS A HEAD SUBMITS HIMSELF TO OTHERS and to CHRIST IN VARIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES. TIME TIME TIME TIME TIME TIME TIME TIME is so important and I cannot stress that enough.

Outside of that I suggest that the people draw up a written covenant contract and in it place a set of men that they will agree to voluntarily submit to if after Matthew 18 attempts in the private family fail that these other men will be called to come bring counsel and aid to the troubled union. A contract/covenant might also have damage clauses in it such as if ABC does XYZ then MNO gets a certain amount of settlement money. Additionaly wills and trusts ought to be established as well. A good legal scholar could be of valuable assistance there.

Dr. Allen

 

[Pretty Tulips]

...

 

[steve]

from "My Jewish Learning"

The Ketubah Text
The traditional Aramaic text of the ketubah (marriage contract) reflects the history of Jewish marriage.
By Rabbi Maurice Lamm Email this page Print this page
This article explains the first half of the traditional ketubah, including the proposal and funds committed to the marriage from the bride's family and the groom. "Explaining the Ketubah Text (Part 2)" describes the additional gift from the groom, contractual protections for his wife, and how the ketubah is sealed.

In liberal communities the bride and groom often write more egalitarian ketubot that reflect their goals for the marriage--either in place of or in addition to the traditional ketubah. Both liberal and some traditional Jews may include a prenuptial agreement in their ketubah that would require the groom to give the bride a get, or Jewish bill of divorce, should the marriage end. Reprinted from The Jewish Way in Love and Marriage by permission of Jonathan David Publishers.

The Date and Place of the Wedding
"On the _______ day of the week, the _______ day of the month _______ in the year _______ since the creation of the world according to the reckoning which we are accustomed to use here in the city of _______ in _______ "

The Date. The law prescribes that the date appear at the beginning in private agreements, but at the end in court agreements. Though the ketubah has the status of a court decree, it is in the nature of a private agreement and so the date is placed first.

The Place. The same rationale is used for the place. A divorce document contains more geographical information (e.g., mention of a neighboring river). The Sephardim [Jews of Spain who, after the Expulsion, emigrated to North Africa and the Middle East] retained this custom, and Rema, in the 16th century, urged that the technicalities of the ketubah follow those of the divorce. But the Talmud simplified the ketubah and the Jews of Europe have followed that tradition.

The Groom, the Bride, & the Proposal
"… _______ son of _______ of the family _______ said to this maiden _______ daughter of _______ of the family _______ "Be thou my wife according to the law of Moses and Israel."

The Names. Their Hebrew names, their fathers' names, and usually, though not always, their family names. The mother's name is given when praying for recovery from illness, as a symbol of mother's compassion. A father's name is used in legal matters, just as a father's family name has always been used in legal affairs. [Today, though, many liberal Jews include the mother's name on a ketubah as well.] Added to their names is also the appellation for a rabbinic scholar, Rav, or priestly or Levitic descent, kohen or Levi.

The Proposal. "Be thou my wife according to the law of Moses and of Israel" is the marriage proposal. The ketubah, following in time as it does the betrothal and its oral proposal formula, "You are hereby betrothed unto me according to the law of Moses and Israel," is written by witnesses testifying that the groom in fact proposed to the bride. The formula has remained intact for some 2,000 years. The Talmud considered variants, but this language of proposal endured.

The Groom Promised the Basic Support
"... and I will work for thee, honor, provide for, and support thee, in accordance with the practice of Jewish husbands, who work for their wives, honor, provide for and support them in truth."

Support. This is referred to as the alimentation clause. Providing support is elemental in marriage, and is considered so obvious that the Talmud makes no reference to it. But the phrase is so beautiful and appropriate that it appears in the ketubah not only once but twice, "honor, provide for, and support... honor, provide for, and support.... " Indeed, one authority described it as le'shufra di'she'tara (for the beauty of the contract).

Funds for the Wife, If and When the Marriage Terminates
"… and I will set aside for thee 200 silver zuz mohar due thee for thy maidenhood, which belong to thee according to the law of the Torah, and thy food, clothing, and other necessary benefits which a husband is obligated to provide; and I will live with thee in accordance with the requirements prescribed for each husband."

The Mohar. The funds, called mohar, are so important that this clause is called ikkar ketubah--the basic part of the ketubah, or simply the ketubah. Mohar is the cash gift the groom gives the bride, as Eliezer, Abraham's servant, gave "precious things" to Laban, Rebekah's father, and as Jacob gave seven years of service for the hand of Rachel. The great sage and the ketubah's most important author, Rabbi Simeon ben Shetach, decreed that this serve as protection for the bride rather than only a gift, and ordained that the funds were not given but set aside for the bride. During marriage, therefore, it was considered a debt which was paid only in case of death or divorce, and the mohar thus became a divorce or life insurance settlement rather than a mere marriage gift. This arrangement also enabled poor grooms to marry without any immediate monetary expenditure. The Talmud provides another reason, mishum china, to give the woman a secure financial position at the time of divorce so that she may remarry, and make the trials of marriage less poignant.

The Law of the Torah. There is a running dispute between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud as to whether this settlement, which all agree is historically of biblical times, is biblically or rabbinically mandated. Today we generally take mohar to be rabbinically commanded, yet because of the gravity of the marriage bond we persist in using, "which belong to thee according to the law of the Torah." We also include "200 silver zuz," the Tyrean coin used in biblical assessments, rather than the "current" coin used in rabbinically ordained payments.

Mohar for brides previously married is one-half the total and is recorded as rabbinically mandated.

Food, Clothing, and Conjugal Relations. The obligations are basic to marriage and are obligatory even without specific contractual condition. They are the rights (including conjugal relations) of the wife, and are accounted duties of the husband.

The Bride Accepted the Proposal
"… and this _______ maiden, consented and became his wife."

Willing Acceptance. The proposal having been made in the traditional formula, the witnesses now assert that the bride accepted with willing consent, and therefore "she became his wife." Ve'havat lih le'into is an Aramaic translation of Ruth 4:13, va-tehi lo le'ishah.

And She Brings a Dowry
"The dowry (nedunya) that she brought from her _______ house, in silver, gold, valuables, clothing, and household furnishings, all this _______ the said groom accepted in the sum of 100 silver pieces."

The Dowry. Nedunya (dowry), popularly referred to as naddan, is given the bride by her father for her use in the home she is about to build. This dowry includes the items listed plus any other valuables she may bring with her. In the Bible, Rachel and Leah are given servants Bilhah and Zilpah as dowry. It is the daughter's share of her parents' inheritance. The sons succeed their father, but the daughters leave him and therefore receive an equivalent in the form of dowry. The sages make it compulsory for a father to give his' daughter, as a start in married life, sufficient funds to buy a woman's wardrobe for one year.

The dowry is distinct from property or possessions that the bride owns and continues to own privately throughout marriage. Thus it serves as an inducement for suitors. The dowry is included in the ketubah, and is the property of the bride, technically "leased" to the groom for the duration of marriage. The bride's private property, called nikhsei melog, is given outright to the bride, the husband enjoying only the "fruit" (usufruct) during marriage. It is not part of the dowry and is not included in the ketubah.

The Groom Accepted. The ketubah originally listed all items in the dowry and tabulated the cost. In time, this was standardized under the general categories listed and estimated at a standard sum of 100 silver pieces, one half of the mohar that the groom provided the bride for use of the dowry, but which, in reality, comes today to very much more than the half mohar.

 

[steve]

another article;

The Ketubah, or Marriage Contract
The ketubah is an ancient contract delineating the obligations of the husband to his wife.
By Rabbi Louis Jacobs
Reprinted with permission from The Jewish Religion: A Companion, published by Oxford University Press.

The [ketubah is the] marriage contract by which a bridegroom obligates himself to provide a settlement for his wife if he divorces her, or his heir if he predeceases her.

Root of the Word
Ketubah, from the root katav, "to write," is the name for both the written contract itself and for the amount the husband is obliged to settle on his wife. The main purpose of the ketubah is to prevent a husband divorcing his wife against her will, which, in talmudic times, he had the right to do. The knowledge that he had to pay his wife her ketubahwould serve as a check against hasty divorce.

The minimum amount for the ketubah is 200 zuz for a virgin and 100 zuz for a widow or divorcee. These amounts were by no means negligible since an average house in talmudic times could be bought for 50 zuz, and if a man had 200 zuz in ready cash, he was no longer eligible for poor-relief.

A groom could, of course, add to the ketubah any amount he wished. A whole tractate of the Mishnah and Talmud, tractate Ketubot, is devoted mainly to the laws of the ketubah. In addition to the basic settlement, the husband undertakes in the ketubah to protect his wife, work for her, provide her with her marital rights and with all that is necessary for her due sustenance.

Since [the ketubah] was a legal document and had to be understood by both parties, it was written in Aramaic, the vernacular in talmudic times. This form is still preserved in the traditional ketubah,though in Anglo Jewry and elsewhere there is an English translation on the back of the document.

In the State of Israel, the ketubah is still an enforceable legal document. In the [United States], the [United Kingdom], and most European countries, marriage arrangements are a matter for the secular civil law, so that the ketubah becomes a formality, every ketubah stating only the amounts of either 200 or 100 zuz. Nevertheless, since in rabbinic law it is forbidden for a man to live with his wife unless she has a ketubah,the drawing up and reading of the ketubah ispart of every Jewish marriage ceremony.

A Husband's Obligations
The ketubah isessentially a statement of the husband's obligations. The obligations of the wife to her husband are not recorded in the ketubah. Most Reform Jews [and Reconstructionist Jews, as well as many Conservative Jews] today, therefore, prefer a different version of the ketubah that is more egalitarian.

It has long been the practice in many communities to have illuminated ketubot, with paintings of birds, flowers, and other ornamental features. Illuminated ketubot from the 19th century and earlier are now collectors' items.

 

[Pretty Tulips]

...

 

[The Duke Of Marshall]

....this is the first time I see it mentioned on a poly site.....

WOOHOO!!! We're trend setters!!

 

[Pretty Tulips]

...

 

[Anonymous]

Are we really interested in relegating marriage to a contract? Contracts with clauses for protection of the innocent, supposing the inevitable or at least likely failure of the marriage?

Why don't we just become men and women of our word and abide by our committment? God's Word declares that the marriage relationship of a man and a woman is a reflection of the relationship of Christ and His church. What do our marriages reflect? Where is our heart?

May God help us to grow beyond mere deal making in regard to marriage. If we can't be committed husbands and wives, with a first wife and a second or third wife, what are we even discussing pm for?

Perhaps some people shouldn't marry at all, if they can't make a genuine committment!

 

[Dr. K.R. Allen]

John said:

Perhaps some people shouldn't marry at all, if they can't make a genuine committment!

Now that is very true! The issue is ultimately about someone's character. And the best way to know someone's character is through observation and time.

Even if we get something in place one day that is enforceable through an ecclesiastical organization or even through a civil code the issue will forever and always be a heart issue. Some people are married and remain married only because they "have to" not because they really love anymore. They remain because divorce would cost too much, or because fear of loosing what they have accumulated.

A contract might be good, and as I have posted in the past on this, I support something like this and will put something in place like this myself at the proper time, but the real issue boils down to the people entering the union really having solid godly character.

Character, true Christlike character supercedes all else and it is worth waiting for by all parties involved.

 

[steve]

Perhaps some people shouldn't marry at all, if they can't make a genuine committment!

very true, but they are probably going to get married anyway. do we just shrug our shoulders and say "i told you so". and how does one know if their intended is making a genuine committment?

And the best way to know someone's character is through observation and time.

i agree for the most part. most of the failures seem to be of the act in haste, repent at leisure variety.
however, people have been known to change. is it better to just ignore that possibility?
and of course there is the possibility of an unplanned-for death. a girl could marry an absolute saint, get pregnant, and the husband and first wife be taken home in a car wreck. all assets going to the the children of the first wife. would you have counselled the girl to just "trust God and not be concerned about it" if she had come to you for pre-marital counselling?
and that brings up the question. you two men are ministers. if a girl comes to you for counselling prior to a marriage, do you honestly propose that she has no need of protection?

I support something like this and will put something in place like this myself at the proper time

great! i am so glad that you agree. what will yours look like? what protections will you be providing your wives and what protections, if any, do you feel that you will need for yourself? will you involve a lawer? please share your thoughts and research on this.

but the real issue boils down to the people entering the union really having solid godly character.

no, the real issue of this thread is the protection of women who marry men who turn out to not be quite as perfect as Yeshua, or who die earlier than planned. if she brings children along with her into the marriage would they be taken care of if anything happened to her? unless there is a contract i would imagine that the state would take them away, or a relative of hers?

 

[steve]

Steve,
That looks great.. but is that a legal document? Or is there a 'modern' version, for lack of better words, of this available, or does one just consult with a lawyer for a legal contract???
I just find it very interesting that most don't talk about this type of thing when adding a wife to the family. I've been aroung plural marriage for a few years now, and this is the first time I see it mentioned on a poly site.
Thanks again!

great questions, girl!
i do not know all of the answers and that is why i wanted the discussion. of course, that form is just a starting point and some of the things do not even apply today.
i am not at all hung-up on the idea of a ketubah itself. i care more about the ideas that they hold. the idea that the wife keeps the ownership of the assets that she brings into the marriage and has the legal documentation to prove it? that her husband cannot with impunity sell her jewelry? do first wives even have that protection in our society? and if she had any amount of her own money coming into the marriage and was asked to leave, she had a legal right to leave with the same amount? without rent and food being deducted from it?

a couple of things that i find facinating about the ketubah is;
1) that they were works of art and kept on display in the home, a continual reminder of what was agreed upon. probably even a reasonable amount of patriarchal pride in showing how much the husband carred about protecting his wife?
2)that if, for any reason, it was not available, the husband was not gettin any. kinda made him want to protect it, dont'cha think?

one thing i do know; if it ain't written down, it never happened! all of the promises do not matter a hill of beans if they are not in writing. even a hand-written will has some validity, and more-so if it is witnessed by others.

 

[Isabella]

if she brings children along with her into the marriage would they be taken care of if anything happened to her? unless there is a contract i would imagine that the state would take them away, or a relative of hers?

Excellent point Steve, especially when you consider many of us come from families who are not supportive, if we are not legal spouses our next of kin will be our birth family who can claim our children if something were to happen to us.
Anything that can be done, whether to write up something traditional or to write up something legal which states our intentions clearly should not be disparaged for the sake of an ideal. For all the best intentions in the world things don't always work out.

B
X

 

[Dr. K.R. Allen]

The following are what I share and teach others to put in place:

1. Medical arrangement documets (Living Will, power of attorney documents, etc) that give power to the spouse(s) so medical decisions can be made if one is incapacitated.

2. Term Life Insurance Policies Need to Be in Place for the spouse(s).

3. A Will Needs to Be in Place by All.

4. A Matthew 18 clause so that if problems arise in a home and they cannot settle it among themselves it is already agreed upon who will be called to come and provide counsel and spiritual guidance.

5. Bank Accounts that are set up by the decision of the individuals.

6. Prior land, property, and assets need to be established as to how much (all or a part) will be merged into the union. And these need to be established in the will as well.

7. A contract or disolution clause that if one leaves for wrongful reasons (connected to the Matthew 18 clause) that damages will be paid out. This can be done with the help of something called a cohabitation agreement that can be enforced through the civil courts if need be. A lawyer can help draw this up.

Those are key points. Other ideas or points can be added by the people as they so see fit but this is what I counsel and tell people they need at the minimum.

Dr. Allen

 

[MarvelousMarvin]

I've been following this thread for a few days, and have read both good and bad advice. So let me share my thoughts...

John W is absolutely right about character – and there are literally millions of boys in adult-sized bodies who are married but should not be. God forbid that any of these yo-yos should decide to "try poly marriage on for size!" What a disaster for all involved, including all of us who advocate Biblical Marriage!

Having said that, though, several individuals made a good point about what could happen in the event of an untimely death. (Is any death ever "timely...?") Not one of us is guaranteed so much as one more heartbeat in this life. A responsible mono hubby, by use of wills, life insurance, etc., will provide for his family as best he can should our Father call him home. Nothing less should be expected for second, third, etc., wives, AND ANY CHILDREN in the family, whether "natural" or "adopted" by the father. As has been pointedly said in other threads, SW is a WIFE to be cherished 'TIL DEATH, as I now cherish my FW, not a puppy to be kicked to the curb when DH or FW gets tired of the "game!"

Here's what I've been considering: each wife should have her own bank account – hubby's name NOT ON IT! (Yes, even the legal wife, if one wife or another has permission from Big Brother to be married...) Every payday, when the wampum is being divided up for mortgage payment, utility bills, gas for the chariots, food, and whatever, some should be deposited in each wife's account. (How much depends on too many factors to make any recomendations here.) That is HERS, to provide for her and any kids she might have, in case Dear Hubby turns out to not be so Dear, or he is called home unexpectedly. Such an account will not have to go through probate unless the OWNER is the one who kicked the bucket. Less messy than life insurance, and unlike life insurance, works for disasters short of hubby's death or serious injury. (Like if the hubby turns out to be a disaster.) Wouldn't hurt for hubby to have his own account as well – not all charlatans are men... Also, each child should have an account for future college tuition as well as disaster relief in the event of the untimely death of mom or dad.

But that does not take care of the custody problems that might exist if a wife (who is not the legal wife) has kids and is called home early. There needs to be something in writing, preferably witnessed and notarized, about who gets the kids. Since I'm not a lawyer, maybe someone who is could post a sample document that we might print out and use in a "fill-in-the-blanks" manner for this. Seems to me that almost anything in writing would be better than nothing.

Also, does anyone know anything about trusts? That might be another tool that could protect the financial interests of all involved in the event of the death of one or more members of the family. It might not protect against character flaws, though, so separate savings/investment accounts as mentioned above would still be a good idea.

What about the house? If not renting, who owns it, and who assumes ownership in case of the untimely death of DH or a wife? Same for cars, pickups, snowmobiles, hubby's or wife's professional tools...that is where a trust might help. (And/or each person holding title to his/her own car, etc.) Stuff like that can be messy enough for a mono marriage that is recognized by the government, but poly marriage that is not viewed as marriage by society could really open up the proverbial can of worms.