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You Keep Them With What You Won Them With.

RGK

New Member
Real Person
The following was taken from the rough drafts of a book I am writing. The book is a practical guide to seeking out and living a Biblical polygynous lifestyle. It is not proclaimed to be some infallible and inspired writing that guarantees success. It is written by a farmer that is giving advice based on his personal observations from his life and the many he has counseled in this area. The name of the Chapter the following rough draft is for is " You keep them with what you won them with". I hope this will help those seeking to expand their family.

I have counseled a lot of men in the area of practicing polygyny. It has been my observation that most problems come from too much emphasis being put on whether or not wife 1 and wife 2 are best friends, or on how much they get along, in deciding who is the best candidate to add to a family. This may be wise if you have a totally secular or matriarchal family, but for those that desire to have a biblical, patriarchal family that mimics Christ and His Bride, this is a train wreck waiting to happen. I call this type of strategy, "Seeker Friendly Family". I borrowed that term from a program that helps churches build their numbers. They call the churches involved in this program "Seeker-Friendly" churches. The idea is to become as close as possible to the world to attract people into the church. I will give you some of the things this program says to do, and see if you can see the problems that can come from this type of approach. When you're looking over this list, ask yourself, "What is the purpose and function of a church supposed to be?" Does this list accomplish that mission, and if no, what does the list produce in the long run? Then I want you to apply that concept to attracting and choosing an additional wife.

In Seeker Friendly churches, the following is what the say should attract people to the church: Comfortable seats, latest technology in the presentation of the message and music, music that most closely resembles the music of the culture they live in, dynamic pastor, gymnasiums, softball and soccer fields, cappuccino machine, beautiful and attractive building, games for the youth, etc. The best of all these accouterments is what you should have in order to win over the public. Its a marketing blitz to win the largest share of the market over the competition -- other churches. These churches can't ever stop the construction because they are in a race with the competition. In the book I read on "Seeker-Friendly" churches, it said that you keep them with what you won them with. If they came for the dynamic preacher, when he's gone they are gone. If they came because you had the latest, greatest youth program, as soon as you do not have the latest greatest youth program they are gone to the church that does. I think you see the principle here. They are exactly right, you only keep them with what you win them. I ask you one question: would you rather have people attracted to the church because the truth of God's Word was being preached, the church was doing its God-mandated role and function in society, the people in the church understood their role and function inside the church, and they wanted to be a part of something bigger than themselves or would you rather have people attracted to the church because they desire the latest greatest church facilities, programs, and the status of attending a church with the nicest cars in the parking lot driven by people with the best cosmetic surgery money can buy, being able to network with those that can help you obtain the American dream of having a house with a 2 car garage that's nicer than your neighbors, the Jones'?

Just as Seeker-Friendly churches are guilty of looking to add to their body by attracting people with programs and "stuff", so are many men who are looking to add to their family. The results are never good, for either the church or the family. Men that want to sell a "best friend" to the potential wife as a drawing point, or who sell a "best friend" to the first wife as a way to make PM desirable, are no different the the tactics used by seeker friendly churches. They both take the focus off of the God-mandated roles in marriage and put the focus on exterior "fluff" benefits instead of core principles.

Whose relationship is more important, the husband/wife or the relationship between the wives? Yes they should love each other, but not because they get along, have compatible personalities, like the same tv show, or have the same zodiac sign. They should love each other because they are both loved by the same man,.and have the same role and functional with the same goal for the family, and most importantly, they should love each other because that is what Christ commanded. These should be the things that cause them to bond and become best friends. A side note-- men are commanded to love their wives from the very beginning and forever. Wives are never commanded to love their husbands. They are to learn to love their husbands from the older wives. This can only be accomplished when the older wives become selfless and put the desires and happiness of the husband and the other wife first. Only in this spirit can an older wife properly and effectively teach a new wife how to love and please their husband. Also, both wives have to put aside their self-preservation and not seek out that "special" place in the husband's heart for themselves.

Keep in mind I'm not saying the relationship between the wives is not important. It is important because it brings honor to the family and the Lord, not because a wife will get someone to watch a chick flick with. You put yourself in the right role and function for the right reasons, and you will automatically get someone to watch a chick flick and go shoe shopping with. There is proof of that in my home. It wasn't until everyone, including myself, realized what our roles and functions were inside the patriarchal family structure and started living out our roles and functions that we had a peaceful, God-honoring home. The most successful PM's are when all of the wives put the desires of the others ahead of their own desires.

If you picked someone based on the relationship between the wives, what happens when that relationship is gone? Answer: one or both wives are gone or everyone is living in misery. If you attract a wife by how well you can give her the nicer things in life, what happens when that capability is gone? I hope you can see how important it is what attracts a wife to you, because you really do keep them with what you won them with. Don't think you can attract her with a best friend as sisterwife and then change her focus to you. Its a lot easier, in the long run, to choose a wife that's attracted to you as a patriarch, first and foremost. Then work on the relationship with the other wife as you go along. If both wives understand where their focus should be, its a piece if cake.

I have personally seen men who used the tactic of putting their wife and any potential together to see if they bonded and became "best friends" before he pursued any type of courtship. This doesn't automatically spell disaster for a family, but I have seen very few families have long-term success using this approach. Most of the failures I have witnessed have involved some form of this "Seeker-Friendly" tactic. I have had men tell me that they don't understand why things fell apart, because the women started out as best friends, and the husband made sure that the women were compatible and were very close, before he pursued anything with a potential wife. But when the reality of living PM set in, their self-preservation kicked in, and jealousies that didn't exist while this lifestyle was only a theory suddenly came to the forefront when the lifestyle became a reality. The wives' relationship crumbled, and now the husband sits wondering what happened and why one or both of his wives are gone.

You really do keep them with what you won them with, whatever that may be.

Robert
Psalm 128
 
Great post, I wish a lot more people took this approach.

Bels
 
Good post, RGK. Makes great sense.
 
Brilliant. I'd never heard this thinking before either, and it sounds solid to me. Thankyou very much for posting this.

Sounds like it will be a good book!
 
Really great post.

RGK said:
have the same role and functional with the same goal for the family

I disagree with this statement. I think I know what you mean. In a global sense they both have the role of wife. However, one of my pet peeves is the insistence that SW's have to be "equal". We are not equal people and to be treated equally would not be a good thing.

It is akin to forcing your son to put on a tutu and do ballet because it isn't fair that his sister gets ballet classes and he does not. After all you have to treat your kids equally right?

My SW used to be a hairdresser. One of her functions in the house is to cut everyone's hair. To suggest that I have the "same function" within the family would lead to some very disastrous results that would have even the dogs embarrassed to go out in public! I recognize my limitations and cutting hair is one of them.

Your intent does not seem to be that the minor detials of how people function is the same, but their overall role is the same - and that I agree with :)
 
In general I think I would agree, after all who wants to marry someone who pulls a bait and switch. Now a word from the contrarian in me. :)
I've attended several "seeker" churches, a couple that are among the largest in America. I believe you will find the same types of people in attendance at any church. Some who attend for the connections, programs, dynamic preacher, etc. Some just because that's what you do on Sundays. There will always be some who get the fact that it's about following God. Those surface level programs are often used to draw the people in and then funnel them, if you will, into small group Bible studies where discipleship and growth happen.

I attended one smaller "seeker" church and the pastor left. The church didn't fall apart and only a small percentage of the church population left. I attribute most of it to the fact that the people understood it wasn't about the preacher.
I'm not saying that all "seeker" friendly churches are like this and one certainly needs to be careful.

I've no wish to start an argument over seeker friendly churches. Rather the point I'm trying to make is that those who get what it's supposed to be about aren't going to run anyway and I believe this may be equally applicable to marriage.
Something for your consideration.
As always I enjoy the discussions that help me refine, what I think and believe, and in some cases reverse what I believe (after all, I did somehow get from monogamy to polygyny). :)
 
I meant to say the function of every one including children should be fulfilling the vision of the patriarch by following his direction on how to accomplish that individually. I was using the term on a generic since, and thru the leadership of the husband. I admit as a husband that I most of the time don't know best who to put where doing what. I rely on my wives to help with their input in this matter when it comes to the running of the house , their roles and functions are not limited to their job title in the house hold. I appreciate your input. I showed me that i needed to be more clear. I hope I can claim being a man as a defense lol.

Robert
 
RGK said:
I hope I can claim being a man as a defense lol.Robert

You really cannot lose with that defense :lol:

Chris: I agree. I find there is somewhat of a social comparison going on between believers. Sort of a "my salvation is more sacred than yours, because I really mean it and I understand more than you do".

I would NEVER have walked into a small church where everyone already believed and knew what they were doing. I would have felt very out of place and very uncomfortable. There was something very non-threatening about a seeker church where it was somewhat anonymous, did not require me to sign on the dotted line as a full fledged member of the church on my first visit and I could dip my toes in and out of the water. It allowed me to learn and progress at my own pace and comfort level. Accepting the message and becoming a Christian was MORE meaningful because there was no aspect of doing it to please people around me or because I felt pressured in anyway - it was something I did because it was something I really truly believed.

I have witnessed the change seeker churches make in people's lives, including my own and that of my children.

I do understand the criticism leveled at seeker churches. Robert makes a valid point that if they came for the music and entertainment, then that is not going to sustain their faith in the long term. That said, if they bring 500 people through the door and only one is actually saved then what did it hurt to have the other 499 go through the revolving door?

I do like the analogy to "seeker marriage".... I certainly do not recommend marrying 500 women to find the one "keeper" :o

Maybe a better analogy is that if you have 500 women seeking marriage then you do not want the one who came for the entertainment (best friend sisterwife) or the coffee shop (BMW in the driveway), but you want the one who goes on to join the Bible study group and the seek the deeper message (looking for a good quality husband)?
 
The thing about seeker friendly churches is that the other "499" people are living a false chrsitianity so to speak. The churchianity culture makes it easy for them to claim chrsitianity and not live it thus "watering down" the church so to speak. Lots of people "hide' in these churches. I agree that they can also serve a good function of being a clearinghouse sort of.
 
I understand some of the criticisms as well. To be fair I grew up in non-seeker type churches and I saw plenty of people acting like saints on Sunday but raising heck the rest of the week. It would appear (based on 30+ years of church attendance in numerous churches ranging from Mennonite, non-denominational to Baptist (several flavors) ) that it doesn't matter what type of church (assuming they preach the Gospel) it is... there will always be those who practice false Christianity as itainteasy put it. I wouldn't be surprised if I haven't fallen into that category a few times myself... :(

Eternitee, I liked what you said in the last sentence... though if she has a BMW I might make an exception... ;) lol
 
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