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Muslims demand poly rights in Italy

Bad news that people associate polygamy Muslims. Guilt by association.
 
Truthfully, as sold as I am on the idea of polygamy; I would not like to live anywhere where Muslim influence is so strongly felt that the nation would consider changing its marriage laws to suit them.

I think that poly and patriarchy would be good medicine for our culture, but if it takes Islamic influence to inject it, I think it would loop right back around to being bad medicine. It would set my mind at ease if women were provided for like only biblical poly can, but I believe when a culture allows poly in order to cater to Islam, that same culture would not allow christian poly.

For instance, I cannot think of a single reason that poly is outlawed when gay marriage is legalized, except that those in power will always be more comfortable with rebellion against Jesus, even if they don't know the relevant doctrines. I envision a country that allows muslim poly to also persecute christian poly, as ridiculous as that sounds.
 
This creates a bit of a window for us. The homosexuals actually did us a favor in breaking down the "one man, one woman" thing. But if we wait too long and it's Muslim immigrants clamoring for polygamy instead of American Christians, we're going to have a very serious problem.

I make no judgments either way about the right or wrong of any of that. Just making observations. And my assessment is that we should be making as much noise as we can while we can to take the lead in this issue.
 
Now that would be a hoot.... :rolleyes:
 
On this I must disagree with Andrew! Personally, I've spent enough time and money fighting for political changes here, and seen my grandfather spend even more, generally unsuccessfully, to have given up on it all and decided that the best thing to do is simply to try and keep my head down and live within the existing system. I stood for parliament here some time ago, got to debate with very prominent sitting members of parliament, enjoyed every minute of it - but didn't actually achieve anything. And even those few good people who do get in cannot do much, as they're outvoted by the rest. Massive amounts of time, money and personal reputation can be expended on this, without achieving any results - or to achieve results that are smaller than desired so not really worth the expenditure, only temporary, or only come through compromising on something else. Ultimately, we're currently under Satan's system, and it's never going to be godly, we're never going to have long-lasting successes within it.

I have realised that I am a citizen of a heavenly Kingdom, and that is where my focus must lie. In that work I can make real achievements, in the lives of individuals. And only through the rule of that Kingdom on earth will things truly be cleaned up.

If de-facto polygyny is legal, then we have all we need. I can see a potential, limited need for political action in those few US states where cohabitation is illegal, if that action is not already being undertaken by others, but outside that very narrow situation we can already live our lives without fear of prosecution, so there is little more to be gained and it's not worth the cost trying to gain it.
 
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Not so fast! Do we really disagree, FH?

With respect to political action, I have my own set of beliefs about how that all plays out, and what's worth fighting for and what's not. But with respect to 'marriage equality for polygynists', so to speak, I see that as a grass roots thing. Person to person, one family or one fellowship at a time.

There's also something to be said for not fighting/arguing/debating generally. Just be the person that others respect enough to listen to and to give the benefit of the doubt when you say something (or live something) counter-cultural. That's the best that any of us can do.
 
My grandfather was heavily involved in the local organisation of the National Party (our counterpart to your Republicans) for decades, then stood for a Christian party in two elections, unsuccessfully. Basically he worked for decades doing what he could to be a solid Christian witness within the political system, in different ways. And all that time, despite the solid work of himself and many others, the country still slipped further away from Christianity. Hence his eventual move into overt Christian politics, since as the main parties became more secular and Christians were marginalised, eventually they formed their own political movement, which unfortunately has been ravaged by infighting and controversy, never achieving anything much sadly. I stood for a different party in a later iteration of this Christian political movement, which was again unsuccessful.

All our countries are on an unstoppable slide towards a political system that will be bad enough to be that prophesied to come before the return of Yeshua. We cannot reverse this, because it has to happen. Things are just going to get worse and worse until Christians are faced with the death penalty, and then things will get better rather spectacularly...

Andrew, I entirely agree with you on a grass-roots level. Regarding political action in America, I'm interested to see how the libertarian party gets on in the USA, but I can't see it being successful, because that isn't the overall agenda. In the slim chance that they are successful, they will become subverted by the same evil influences and be ultimately turned against Christians, including Christian polygynists - simply because there is a bigger story that has to play out, and will happen one way or another, through whoever is in power. The same goes for Trump.

This might sound pessimistic, but I don't actually feel the slightest bit pessimistic. I'm very optimistic. I believe we live in very interesting times, and have amazing opportunities in these times. We just need to recognise the times in order to see the opportunities and not get distracted from them.
 
I personally feel that we should attempt to effect change in our political structure to better support and protect PM. Not because I think we *need* the blessing of the government, but because it simply makes life a bit easier for poly families. We definitely should not put our faith in the political machine or pursue it at the cost of other important things, but I can't see the logic in not even trying. That's like saying "Well the roof has a couple leaks in it... Rain is coming and since I probably can't fix *all* the leaks I guess there's no point fixing any of them!"
 
There's another angle here too, at least for me. A story is told of an old prophet that on a daily basis would roam the streets of his village preaching righteousness and repentance, despite that fact that his village was thoroughly wicked and gleefully reprobate. One time a group of younger men approached him mockingly and asked, "Why do you waste your time old man? You know you're not going to change anything!". His response was, "I don't preach to change them. I preach to keep them from changing me."

Because I am a follower of Jesus Christ, I have a set of values I cannot compromise. Because I believe in the ideal of individual liberty that guided the founding of this country, I will continue to discharge what I see as my duty as a citizen no matter what everybody else is doing. It's not up to me to measure the odds of success and panic or despair. It's just up to me to stay faithful to do what I can do.
 
UntoldGlory, I'm rather nervous about what a government might do to "better support and protect PM". The medicine could easily be worse than the disease. I'd much prefer to keep them out of the marriage business entirely. As I see it, Western countries are busy making it easier and easier to live in de-facto situations and the courts are busy making case law on how to handle weird and wacky living arrangements, the boat's going in a good direction, I wouldn't want to rock it too much.

Andrew, I completely agree. On the interpersonal scale you mentioned earlier.
 
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