Chaplain, Sir
I would like to address some issues between us to better qualify my position here as a fellow member and to dissolve any misunderstanding that we might have had in the past. To begin with, I want you to know that I respect you as a fellow member and admire you for your zeal for the cause of godly plural marriage. I am not the enemy here. I noticed that you and I have similar backgrounds (although not the same) and I should like to resolve any animosity that might be lingering between us in this fine forum. You are a man from the south. I am from the far north... The Canadian North, to be accurate. I realize that to the west of me there is a polygynous cult in my sister province that suffers much persecution and is currently under much public scrutiny. I would like to state for the record that I am not part of that group although I am praying for their leader. I am independant. So far you are the only one here to my knowledge that has expressly stated that you have taken offence to my words and this saddens me. Is there some way that I might make amends? I realize that although I have been a member here for some time now that I haven't been consistently active until recently. I should like to quote you here, not to stir up any old coals beneath the ashes, but to rather lay the matter to rest. On March 30th. 2008 I started this thread in this forum viewtopic.php?f=28&t=43 The thread actually came alive to the purpose for which it was intended and I would also like to thank those brothers who understood my circumstances and prayed for me that my beloved wife and daughter might be returned to me.
I must confess that I did not read this post until recently but now you already know which particular "'lil lady from Louisana" I am referring too and if anyone here actually prayed on my behalf it is also good to confirm their prayers for me and to thank them all for their good will for which I am truly grateful. I have finally held my beautiful daughter in my arms and there are no words to express the feelings that are part of this. Abigail is so very precious to me as is her dear mother. None of this could happen without tremendous sacrifice on all our parts. The LORD knows what risks we had to take and what we sacrificed to bring about this event. It has been very slow going. I would appeal to your reason and sense of empathy, sir. If you had been in my shoes and if you were refused access to your own flesh and blood as I was... How would you feel? Furthermore, what would you do if they refused to allow the child to be called by your name even though this was the MOTHER'S decision at birth? What would you do when you had already sent them legal documentation signed, stamped, and witnessed by a Commisoner of Oaths, stating that you were indeed the said father and indeed granted permission for the child to be called by your name and STILL they denied BOTH the mother's and father's request? Such oppressive laws do not exist here, in Canada. In Canada the mother may name the child whatever she wishes by first and last name and the father needn't be present at the event either in such cases; but this is not the case in Louisiana. The reason it is not the case in Louisiana is because Louisiana does NOT RECOGNIZE Common-law marriage as lawful. According to the State of Louisiana Hope and I are not lawfully wed. Even though we did inded have a public wedding ceremony in the presence of witnesses, we signed no documents. Furthermore, the government certified marriage license did indeed have it's origins in Louisiana and was originally established specifically for the purposes of miscegenation (interracial marriage). Immigration also played a role in the development of the government issued certification of marriage but "same race" marriage licenses only applied optionally in the late 1800's. By 1923 all of this began to change. Intermarriage was no longer the only reason for citizens to apply for a government sanctioned license to marry. You can look this up in a Blacks Law Dictionary. Prior to this, such matters dealing with certification of marriage was the sole business of the church - not the State. I have a link someplace on this that might help people to better understand the 1923 origin of the marriage license established under the Uniform Marriage and Marriage License Act (later to be dubbed the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act in 1929). Here is the link: http://www.mercyseat.net/pamphlets/marriagelicense.html
I heard this sermon preached by the pastor in a live recording once. It was very good but not quite the same as worded here, but then, I am not Matt Trewhella. He would know best. I apologise for any offence taken. I know that I was offended by some in Lousiana that did not respect my Nation's laws touching Common-Law marriage which is still considered lawful in Canada. I was bitter, I confess, that my daughter was being held from me by the mere consequnce of needless legalities on both sides of the border. The Word says, that is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come! It is certainly not my desire to offend any here and I heartily agree that all secularist laws governing what GOD has called "one flesh" are not the business of secular government. Although I do not agree with all of this protestant man's views I think that it is very heartening and encouraging to see that some of the views of the mainstream pastors are finally beginning to coalesce with what many of us have known all along... MARRIAGE is not the business of the secular Government. To save you any additional trouble I will post the pastor' words here:
5 Reasons Why Christians Should Not Obtain a State Marriage License
by Rev. Matthew Trewhella
Every year thousands of Christians amble down to their local county courthouse and obtain a marriage license from the State in order to marry their future spouse. They do this unquestioningly. They do it because their pastor has told them to go get one, and besides, "everybody else gets one." This pamphlet attempts to answer the question - why should we not get one?
1. The definition of a "license" demands that we not obtain one to marry. Black’s Law Dictionary defines "license" as, "The permission by competent authority ["] to do an act which without such permission, would be illegal. We need to ask ourselves - why should it be illegal to marry without the State’s permission? More importantly, why should we need the State’s permission to participate in something which God instituted (Gen. 2:18-24)? We should not need the State’s permission to marry nor should we grovel before state officials to seek it. What if you apply and the State says "no"? You must understand that the authority to license implies the power to prohibit. A license by definition "confers a right" to do something. The State cannot grant the right to marry. It is a God-given right.
2. When you marry with a marriage license, you grant the State jurisdiction over your marriage. When you marry with a marriage license, your marriage is a creature of the State. It is a corporation of the State! Therefore, they have jurisdiction over your marriage including the fruit of your marriage. What is the fruit of your marriage? Your children and every piece of property you own. There is plenty of case law in American jurisprudence which declares this to be true.
In 1993, parents were upset here in Wisconsin because a test was being administered to their children in the government schools which was very invasive of the family’s privacy. When parents complained, they were shocked by the school bureaucrats who informed them that their children were required to take the test by law and that they would have to take the test because they (the government school) had jurisdiction over their children. When parents asked the bureaucrats what gave them jurisdiction, the bureaucrats answered, "your marriage license and their birth certificates." Judicially, and in increasing fashion, practically, your state marriage license has far-reaching implications.
3. When you marry with a marriage license, you place yourself under a body of law which is immoral. By obtaining a marriage license, you place yourself under the jurisdiction of Family Court which is governed by unbiblical and immoral laws. Under these laws, you can divorce for any reason. Often, the courts side with the spouse who is in rebellion to God, and castigates the spouse who remains faithful by ordering him or her not to speak about the Bible or other matters of faith when present with the children.
As a minister, I cannot in good conscience perform a marriage which would place people under this immoral body of laws. I also cannot marry someone with a marriage license because to do so I have to act as an agent of the State! I would have to sign the marriage license, and I would have to mail it into the State. Given the State’s demand to usurp the place of God and family regarding marriage, and given it’s unbiblical, immoral laws to govern marriage, it would be an act of treason for me to do so.
4. The marriage license invades and removes God-given parental authority. When you read the Bible, you see that God intended for children to have their father’s blessing regarding whom they married. Daughters were to be given in marriage by their fathers (Dt. 22:16; Ex. 22:17; I Cor. 7:38). We have a vestige of this in our culture today in that the father takes his daughter to the front of the altar and the minister asks, "Who gives this woman to be married to this man?"
Historically, there was no requirement to obtain a marriage license in colonial America. When you read the laws of the colonies and then the states, you see only two requirements for marriage. First, you had to obtain your parents permission to marry, and second, you had to post public notice of the marriage 5-15 days before the ceremony.
Notice you had to obtain your parents permission. Back then you saw godly government displayed in that the State recognized the parents authority by demanding that the parents permission be obtained. Today, the all-encompassing ungodly State demands that their permission be obtained to marry.
By issuing marriage licenses, the State is saying, "You don’t need your parents permission, you need our permission." If parents are opposed to their child’s marrying a certain person and refuse to give their permission, the child can do an end run around the parents authority by obtaining the State’s permission, and marry anyway. This is an invasion and removal of God-given parental authority by the State.
5. When you marry with a marriage license, you are like a polygamist. From the State’s point of view, when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, but you are also marrying the State.
The most blatant declaration of this fact that I have ever found is a brochure entitled "With This Ring I Thee Wed." It is found in county courthouses across Ohio where people go to obtain their marriage licenses. It is published by the Ohio State Bar Association. The opening paragraph under the subtitle "Marriage Vows" states, "Actually, when you repeat your marriage vows you enter into a legal contract. There are three parties to that contract. 1.You; 2. Your husband or wife, as the case may be; and 3. the State of Ohio."
See, the State and the lawyers know that when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, you are marrying the State! You are like a polygamist! You are not just making a vow to your spouse, but you are making a vow to the State and your spouse. You are also giving undue jurisdiction to the State.
When Does the State Have Jurisdiction Over a Marriage?
God intended the State to have jurisdiction over a marriage for two reasons - 1). in the case of divorce, and 2). when crimes are committed i.e., adultery, bigamy. etc. Unfortunately, the State now allows divorce for any reason, and it does not prosecute for adultery.
In either case, divorce or crime, a marriage license is not necessary for the courts to determine whether a marriage existed or not. What is needed are witnesses. This is why you have a best man and a maid of honor. They should sign the marriage certificate in your family Bible, and the wedding day guest book should be kept
Marriage was instituted by God, therefore it is a God-given right. According to Scripture, it is to be governed by the family, and the State only has jurisdiction in the cases of divorce or crime.
History of Marriage Licenses in America
George Washington was married without a marriage license. So, how did we come to this place in America where marriage licenses are issued?
Historically, all the states in America had laws outlawing the marriage of blacks and whites. In the mid-1800’s, certain states began allowing interracial marriages or miscegenation as long as those marrying received a license from the state. In other words they had to receive permission to do an act which without such permission would have been illegal.
Blacks Law Dictionary points to this historical fact when it defines "marriage license" as, "A license or permission granted by public authority to persons who intend to intermarry." "Intermarry" is defined in Black’s Law Dictionary as, "Miscegenation; mixed or interracial marriages."
Give the State an inch and they will take a 100 miles (or as one elderly woman once said to me "10,000 miles.") Not long after these licenses were issued, some states began requiring all people who marry to obtain a marriage license. In 1923, the Federal Government established the Uniform Marriage and Marriage License Act (they later established the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act). By 1929, every state in the Union had adopted marriage license laws.
What Should We Do?
Christian couples should not be marrying with State marriage licenses, nor should ministers be marrying people with State marriage licenses. Some have said to me, "If someone is married without a marriage license, then they aren’t really married." Given the fact that states may soon legalize same-sex marriages, we need to ask ourselves, "If a man and a man marry with a State marriage license, and a man and woman marry without a State marriage license - who’s really married? Is it the two men with a marriage license, or the man and woman without a marriage license? In reality, this contention that people are not really married unless they obtain a marriage license simply reveals how Statist we are in our thinking. We need to think biblically. (As for homosexuals marrying, outlaw sodomy as God's law demands, and there will be no threat of sodomites marrying.)
You should not have to obtain a license from the State to marry someone anymore than you should have to obtain a license from the State to be a parent, which some in academic and legislative circles are currently pushing to be made law.
When I marry a couple, I always buy them a Family Bible which contains birth and death records, and a marriage certificate. We record the marriage in the Family Bible. What’s recorded in a Family Bible will stand up as legal evidence in any court of law in America. Early Americans were married without a marriage license. They simply recorded their marriages in their Family Bibles. So should we.
(Pastor Trewhella has been marrying couples without marriage licenses for ten years. Many other pastors also refuse to marry couples with State marriage licenses.)
This pamphlet is not comprehensive in scope. Rather, the purpose of this pamphlet is to make you think and give you a starting point to do further study of your own.
If you would like an audio sermon regarding this matter, just send a gift of at least five dollars in cash to: Mercy Seat Christian Church 10240 W. National Ave. PMB #129 Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53227.
Pastor Matt Trewhella is the pastor of Mercy Seat Christian Church
in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, and the founder of Missionaries to the Preborn.
He and his wife, Clara, have had three sons and two daughter since the reversal.
***********************************************************************************************
Once again, I thank you all kindly for your prayers.
This was the whole of the tract. May JESUS, the only wise GOD, bless you in the knowledge of full Bible truth.
I would like to address some issues between us to better qualify my position here as a fellow member and to dissolve any misunderstanding that we might have had in the past. To begin with, I want you to know that I respect you as a fellow member and admire you for your zeal for the cause of godly plural marriage. I am not the enemy here. I noticed that you and I have similar backgrounds (although not the same) and I should like to resolve any animosity that might be lingering between us in this fine forum. You are a man from the south. I am from the far north... The Canadian North, to be accurate. I realize that to the west of me there is a polygynous cult in my sister province that suffers much persecution and is currently under much public scrutiny. I would like to state for the record that I am not part of that group although I am praying for their leader. I am independant. So far you are the only one here to my knowledge that has expressly stated that you have taken offence to my words and this saddens me. Is there some way that I might make amends? I realize that although I have been a member here for some time now that I haven't been consistently active until recently. I should like to quote you here, not to stir up any old coals beneath the ashes, but to rather lay the matter to rest. On March 30th. 2008 I started this thread in this forum viewtopic.php?f=28&t=43 The thread actually came alive to the purpose for which it was intended and I would also like to thank those brothers who understood my circumstances and prayed for me that my beloved wife and daughter might be returned to me.
Chaplain said:
I must confess that I did not read this post until recently but now you already know which particular "'lil lady from Louisana" I am referring too and if anyone here actually prayed on my behalf it is also good to confirm their prayers for me and to thank them all for their good will for which I am truly grateful. I have finally held my beautiful daughter in my arms and there are no words to express the feelings that are part of this. Abigail is so very precious to me as is her dear mother. None of this could happen without tremendous sacrifice on all our parts. The LORD knows what risks we had to take and what we sacrificed to bring about this event. It has been very slow going. I would appeal to your reason and sense of empathy, sir. If you had been in my shoes and if you were refused access to your own flesh and blood as I was... How would you feel? Furthermore, what would you do if they refused to allow the child to be called by your name even though this was the MOTHER'S decision at birth? What would you do when you had already sent them legal documentation signed, stamped, and witnessed by a Commisoner of Oaths, stating that you were indeed the said father and indeed granted permission for the child to be called by your name and STILL they denied BOTH the mother's and father's request? Such oppressive laws do not exist here, in Canada. In Canada the mother may name the child whatever she wishes by first and last name and the father needn't be present at the event either in such cases; but this is not the case in Louisiana. The reason it is not the case in Louisiana is because Louisiana does NOT RECOGNIZE Common-law marriage as lawful. According to the State of Louisiana Hope and I are not lawfully wed. Even though we did inded have a public wedding ceremony in the presence of witnesses, we signed no documents. Furthermore, the government certified marriage license did indeed have it's origins in Louisiana and was originally established specifically for the purposes of miscegenation (interracial marriage). Immigration also played a role in the development of the government issued certification of marriage but "same race" marriage licenses only applied optionally in the late 1800's. By 1923 all of this began to change. Intermarriage was no longer the only reason for citizens to apply for a government sanctioned license to marry. You can look this up in a Blacks Law Dictionary. Prior to this, such matters dealing with certification of marriage was the sole business of the church - not the State. I have a link someplace on this that might help people to better understand the 1923 origin of the marriage license established under the Uniform Marriage and Marriage License Act (later to be dubbed the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act in 1929). Here is the link: http://www.mercyseat.net/pamphlets/marriagelicense.html
I heard this sermon preached by the pastor in a live recording once. It was very good but not quite the same as worded here, but then, I am not Matt Trewhella. He would know best. I apologise for any offence taken. I know that I was offended by some in Lousiana that did not respect my Nation's laws touching Common-Law marriage which is still considered lawful in Canada. I was bitter, I confess, that my daughter was being held from me by the mere consequnce of needless legalities on both sides of the border. The Word says, that is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come! It is certainly not my desire to offend any here and I heartily agree that all secularist laws governing what GOD has called "one flesh" are not the business of secular government. Although I do not agree with all of this protestant man's views I think that it is very heartening and encouraging to see that some of the views of the mainstream pastors are finally beginning to coalesce with what many of us have known all along... MARRIAGE is not the business of the secular Government. To save you any additional trouble I will post the pastor' words here:
5 Reasons Why Christians Should Not Obtain a State Marriage License
by Rev. Matthew Trewhella
Every year thousands of Christians amble down to their local county courthouse and obtain a marriage license from the State in order to marry their future spouse. They do this unquestioningly. They do it because their pastor has told them to go get one, and besides, "everybody else gets one." This pamphlet attempts to answer the question - why should we not get one?
1. The definition of a "license" demands that we not obtain one to marry. Black’s Law Dictionary defines "license" as, "The permission by competent authority ["] to do an act which without such permission, would be illegal. We need to ask ourselves - why should it be illegal to marry without the State’s permission? More importantly, why should we need the State’s permission to participate in something which God instituted (Gen. 2:18-24)? We should not need the State’s permission to marry nor should we grovel before state officials to seek it. What if you apply and the State says "no"? You must understand that the authority to license implies the power to prohibit. A license by definition "confers a right" to do something. The State cannot grant the right to marry. It is a God-given right.
2. When you marry with a marriage license, you grant the State jurisdiction over your marriage. When you marry with a marriage license, your marriage is a creature of the State. It is a corporation of the State! Therefore, they have jurisdiction over your marriage including the fruit of your marriage. What is the fruit of your marriage? Your children and every piece of property you own. There is plenty of case law in American jurisprudence which declares this to be true.
In 1993, parents were upset here in Wisconsin because a test was being administered to their children in the government schools which was very invasive of the family’s privacy. When parents complained, they were shocked by the school bureaucrats who informed them that their children were required to take the test by law and that they would have to take the test because they (the government school) had jurisdiction over their children. When parents asked the bureaucrats what gave them jurisdiction, the bureaucrats answered, "your marriage license and their birth certificates." Judicially, and in increasing fashion, practically, your state marriage license has far-reaching implications.
3. When you marry with a marriage license, you place yourself under a body of law which is immoral. By obtaining a marriage license, you place yourself under the jurisdiction of Family Court which is governed by unbiblical and immoral laws. Under these laws, you can divorce for any reason. Often, the courts side with the spouse who is in rebellion to God, and castigates the spouse who remains faithful by ordering him or her not to speak about the Bible or other matters of faith when present with the children.
As a minister, I cannot in good conscience perform a marriage which would place people under this immoral body of laws. I also cannot marry someone with a marriage license because to do so I have to act as an agent of the State! I would have to sign the marriage license, and I would have to mail it into the State. Given the State’s demand to usurp the place of God and family regarding marriage, and given it’s unbiblical, immoral laws to govern marriage, it would be an act of treason for me to do so.
4. The marriage license invades and removes God-given parental authority. When you read the Bible, you see that God intended for children to have their father’s blessing regarding whom they married. Daughters were to be given in marriage by their fathers (Dt. 22:16; Ex. 22:17; I Cor. 7:38). We have a vestige of this in our culture today in that the father takes his daughter to the front of the altar and the minister asks, "Who gives this woman to be married to this man?"
Historically, there was no requirement to obtain a marriage license in colonial America. When you read the laws of the colonies and then the states, you see only two requirements for marriage. First, you had to obtain your parents permission to marry, and second, you had to post public notice of the marriage 5-15 days before the ceremony.
Notice you had to obtain your parents permission. Back then you saw godly government displayed in that the State recognized the parents authority by demanding that the parents permission be obtained. Today, the all-encompassing ungodly State demands that their permission be obtained to marry.
By issuing marriage licenses, the State is saying, "You don’t need your parents permission, you need our permission." If parents are opposed to their child’s marrying a certain person and refuse to give their permission, the child can do an end run around the parents authority by obtaining the State’s permission, and marry anyway. This is an invasion and removal of God-given parental authority by the State.
5. When you marry with a marriage license, you are like a polygamist. From the State’s point of view, when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, but you are also marrying the State.
The most blatant declaration of this fact that I have ever found is a brochure entitled "With This Ring I Thee Wed." It is found in county courthouses across Ohio where people go to obtain their marriage licenses. It is published by the Ohio State Bar Association. The opening paragraph under the subtitle "Marriage Vows" states, "Actually, when you repeat your marriage vows you enter into a legal contract. There are three parties to that contract. 1.You; 2. Your husband or wife, as the case may be; and 3. the State of Ohio."
See, the State and the lawyers know that when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, you are marrying the State! You are like a polygamist! You are not just making a vow to your spouse, but you are making a vow to the State and your spouse. You are also giving undue jurisdiction to the State.
When Does the State Have Jurisdiction Over a Marriage?
God intended the State to have jurisdiction over a marriage for two reasons - 1). in the case of divorce, and 2). when crimes are committed i.e., adultery, bigamy. etc. Unfortunately, the State now allows divorce for any reason, and it does not prosecute for adultery.
In either case, divorce or crime, a marriage license is not necessary for the courts to determine whether a marriage existed or not. What is needed are witnesses. This is why you have a best man and a maid of honor. They should sign the marriage certificate in your family Bible, and the wedding day guest book should be kept
Marriage was instituted by God, therefore it is a God-given right. According to Scripture, it is to be governed by the family, and the State only has jurisdiction in the cases of divorce or crime.
History of Marriage Licenses in America
George Washington was married without a marriage license. So, how did we come to this place in America where marriage licenses are issued?
Historically, all the states in America had laws outlawing the marriage of blacks and whites. In the mid-1800’s, certain states began allowing interracial marriages or miscegenation as long as those marrying received a license from the state. In other words they had to receive permission to do an act which without such permission would have been illegal.
Blacks Law Dictionary points to this historical fact when it defines "marriage license" as, "A license or permission granted by public authority to persons who intend to intermarry." "Intermarry" is defined in Black’s Law Dictionary as, "Miscegenation; mixed or interracial marriages."
Give the State an inch and they will take a 100 miles (or as one elderly woman once said to me "10,000 miles.") Not long after these licenses were issued, some states began requiring all people who marry to obtain a marriage license. In 1923, the Federal Government established the Uniform Marriage and Marriage License Act (they later established the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act). By 1929, every state in the Union had adopted marriage license laws.
What Should We Do?
Christian couples should not be marrying with State marriage licenses, nor should ministers be marrying people with State marriage licenses. Some have said to me, "If someone is married without a marriage license, then they aren’t really married." Given the fact that states may soon legalize same-sex marriages, we need to ask ourselves, "If a man and a man marry with a State marriage license, and a man and woman marry without a State marriage license - who’s really married? Is it the two men with a marriage license, or the man and woman without a marriage license? In reality, this contention that people are not really married unless they obtain a marriage license simply reveals how Statist we are in our thinking. We need to think biblically. (As for homosexuals marrying, outlaw sodomy as God's law demands, and there will be no threat of sodomites marrying.)
You should not have to obtain a license from the State to marry someone anymore than you should have to obtain a license from the State to be a parent, which some in academic and legislative circles are currently pushing to be made law.
When I marry a couple, I always buy them a Family Bible which contains birth and death records, and a marriage certificate. We record the marriage in the Family Bible. What’s recorded in a Family Bible will stand up as legal evidence in any court of law in America. Early Americans were married without a marriage license. They simply recorded their marriages in their Family Bibles. So should we.
(Pastor Trewhella has been marrying couples without marriage licenses for ten years. Many other pastors also refuse to marry couples with State marriage licenses.)
This pamphlet is not comprehensive in scope. Rather, the purpose of this pamphlet is to make you think and give you a starting point to do further study of your own.
If you would like an audio sermon regarding this matter, just send a gift of at least five dollars in cash to: Mercy Seat Christian Church 10240 W. National Ave. PMB #129 Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53227.
Pastor Matt Trewhella is the pastor of Mercy Seat Christian Church
in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, and the founder of Missionaries to the Preborn.
He and his wife, Clara, have had three sons and two daughter since the reversal.
***********************************************************************************************
Once again, I thank you all kindly for your prayers.
This was the whole of the tract. May JESUS, the only wise GOD, bless you in the knowledge of full Bible truth.
) re-enactors. They know that I make mistakes and screw up at times like everyone else; that I do not go around with my nose in the air like some, but that I have something that they wish they had or had more of. They know that when I share Gods word with them, it is not to make myself look good or smart, but to share what the LORD has to say about things and issues and that I speak with passion and with truth for I share a lot from my own past. Honor and respect are 2 of the things my father instilled in me as I was growing up. They are 2 things that can and do speak about someone when nothing else can. Your words of wisdom and your experiences are needed here so that others may learn from them, and I for one Thank You for sharing them with us.